SWTOR 3.0 Global Combat Changes Livestream Notes

SWTOR 3.0 Global Combat changes from today’s Livestream notes.

Twitch link: http://www.twitch.tv/swtor/b/583547078

Sniper Virulence now available in the discipline calc minus utilities (they didn’t show them)

DPS Changes

  • We want to look at global DPS. Some classes have exceeded the baseline values we setup. We took the opportunity to get the classes back to the baseline values we wanted (i.e. DPS numbers were creeping up, we toned it down). Players at level 60 will do similar DPS as current level 55s while the 55s in 3.0 will do less DPS than current 55s.
  • We also made some changes so that all the mobs in leveling planets etc will now die faster
  • Nightmare DF/DP might be get a bit difficult due to these changes but we will make some adjustments.
  • Nightmare DF/DP will rolled into an optional part of the new endgame content and might be another path to gear for level 60s by either keeping ultimate comms or adding gear drops from the new operations into them.

Raid Buffs

  • Every advanced class now get raid buffs – either all have it or restricted to a specific discipline
    • Debuffs that make mobs take more damage from different attacks, armor debuff etc
    • Buffs – everyone get healed more etc
  • Also raidwide buffs with their own lockouts such as Bloodthrist, alacrity buff, crit chance buff, etc.
  • These will be able to be used in PvP, except for arenas.
  • The idea of these buffs is to make you to bring players of every base class.

Training dummies

  • Operation Dummies on your ship now get a module that allow you to apply all the raid debuffs to it

swtor-training-dummy-armor-reduction-module

DoTs

  • DoTs from players can no longer be cleansed. You can still purge them off.
    • Cleanses are what healers get to cast on other people. Purges are what people uses on themselves (agent – evasion, assassins – force shroud, sorcs –force barrier)
    • The change was made to ensure DoT classes are still viable in PvP
  • DoTs from mobs can still be cleared
  • Most of the crowd control effects can now be cleansed – adds more team play to PvP.
    • Can you force cleanse a tech stun etc? (Don’t think so but don’t quote me on that, we might be getting rid of the concept of types of cleanses).
  • Cooldown of cleansed increased (12s CD)
    • If the increased cooldown causes difficulty in content, we will change the content.

Interrupts

  • Increased cooldown on interrupts – melee increased to 12s and ranged increased to 18s. Make you pick what to interrupt.

Channeled Abilities

  • Channels – abilities that start to happen as soon as you press the button.
  • Channels are no longer going to be affected by pushback (it will no longer end sooner or cause you to miss ticks). You can still be interrupted or knocked back.
  • Resource cost of channels now changed so there is a cost per tick instead of a huge upfront cost (mostly a QoL change).

Accuracy changes

  • A bunch of passives removed from the skill trees when we changed to the discipline system. We got rid of everyone’s accuracy skills via this change.
  • We turned up the accuracy you get from your accuracy rating but you also need to gear up accuracy.
  • Tanks in tank stance get a bunch of free accuracy (10% accuracy at the expense of some damage loss).
  • Taunt now are able to miss if you don’t have high accuracy – this is mostly a PvP change as we want taunts able to miss so there is not a huge damage reduction.

Alacrity changes

  • Alacrity has always been the red haired stepchild of the stats.
  • Alacrity now does the following
    • Speed up ability activation, GCD, resource generation
    • Speed up dot ticks, duration of channel and DoTs
    • Reduce internal cooldowns on stuff like procs.
    • If you have 20% alacrity, you should be hitting all of your buttons 20% faster

Crit changes

  • No changes to crit, we might have to make changes sometimes to make it better.

Buff/debuff changes

  • Effect procs – Abilities that benefits from procs are now highlighted on your hotbar when the proc is active.

swtor-effect-procs

  • Player debuffs and player buffs bars are now separated – this is just for the player frame at the moment and not for focus or raid frames.

swtor-player-buffs-debuffs-separation

  • You can now also control how the buffs/debuffs expand (up or down, left or right) and how many are present per row

swtor-player-buffs-debuffs-separation-3swtor-player-buffs-debuffs-separation-2

  • Highlight effects – any effects you apply yourself (i.e. buffs, debuffs) can now be highlighted. You could filter it so the highlight could be any duration, 1 min or below, 5 mins or below, 1 hr or below.

swtor-player-buff-debuff-highlightsswtor-player-buff-debuff-highlights-2

  • Sorting options – personal effects can also now be sorted to the front. Effects can also be sorted by apply time, total duration, by time remaining.

swtor-effects-sorting

  • There are some improvements to the raid frames that may not make it to 3.0. The lockouts on the raid buffs could clutter the raid frames and we are looking into it.
  • Not something that is guaranteed – we are looking to sort debuffs by those that can be cleansed first.

Discipline changes

  • Lethality skill tree only for operatives, the sniper variant is named Virulence for example.
  • Madness skill tree only for sorcs, the assassin variant is named Hatred.

Bolster

  • Bolster will now take account of player’s augments in 3.0. Augments are no longer free stats.
  • Bolster will give you augment stats but not the best augments obviously.
  • Aiming for 20-25% gear difference between newbie and most geared PvPers. Augments were responsible for 16% of your power in 2.0.

PvP Gear/Expertise

  • We are not striping the expertise off current PvP gear like we did in 2.0 for War Hero stuff.
  • Expertise cap not changing – 2018 expertise is still the cap.
  • Better PvP gear will have more stats, not expertise.
  • 3.0 will bring two new PvP sets – warzone and ranked warzone comms
  • High level PvE gear will not get as much expertise from bolster.

Line of Sight

  • Most ranged attacks have 180 LoS, now we are changing it to 270. This change was done mostly for FoV people play it on screen and make it so that it is harder for players to escape your abilities.

Q&A

  • Q: Are healers and tanks expected to respec to DPS to level though content
    • A: It shouldn’t be an issue, it should be easier slightly than now.
  • Q: Taunts can now miss on Operation bosses?
    • A: Dependent on the operation boss, the system now allow this capacity and some bosses can have buffs that have extra defense to force players to gear up accuracy.
  • Q: Bolster – Full level 55 PvP gear and max expertise. If you go a level 60 warzone, will your stats be increased.
    • A: Expertise and stats change are separately handled by bolster. If your stats are lower it will be increased. 
  • Q: What happen to warzone and ranked warzone comms in 3.0?
    • A: Get you an answer tomorrow or next week. The answer is likely nothing but we will find out for sure.
  • Q: Can you explain lower damage at level 60
    • A: If you are at 186 gear at 55, when you login your DPS will come down. If you equip the 198 gear and be level 60, your DPS will be similar to current 55s with 186 gear.
  • Q: New color crystals?
    • A: There might be one tied to PvP
  • Q: Any change to +41 color crystals
    • A: No changes to +41 color crystals. No plan to increase it further.
  • Q: Will augments and augment kits go up in level?
    • A: Yes
  • Q: Increasing secondary stats on augments like crit, alacrity to make them desirable compared to main stats?
    • A:  I havn’t done a full scan of the augments, but I would be surprised if the secondary stats are increased
  • Q: Set bonuses same for PvP/PvE?
    • Yes but you can’t equip PvP or PvE gear to push up set bonuses. PvP/PvE gear have the same bonuses but they are technically different set.
  • Q: Will cleanses work on all CC?
    • Anything with duration will work (i.e. no knockbacks)
  • Q: How does alacrity affect classes those without resource regen like JK
    • You activate abilities faster so you get resources faster
  • Q: Accuracy in PvP – will there be much changes?
    • A: Not really. You won’t notice much unless you are going up against someone geared for defense.
  • Q: Main stat passive removed from discipline tree?
    • A: Also gone for the most part
  • AbnerDoon

    It is sounding a bit scary. But I am only thinking happy thoughts until the xpac comes out and I can see the changes in action.

    • Tinsan

      I think they want to add this new “cool” feature because of Halloween 😛 But i am also a little bit scaried about the new things.

  • Jonathan Parker

    All I care about is balance… I can still get into a PvP match, with 8 stealth DPS enemy players, and get torn to shreds without ever having a chance to fight back. I’ve literally seen teams of Sith Assassins one-shot every player on a team just by sneaking up behind them one by one and then going back into stealth.

    • Elfa

      Stealth is a skill that should have never made it into the game and the devs know it by now.

      • KShrike

        Don’t know what you’re talking about. Stealth is a very Star Warsy thing, especially in KOTOR, which is the prequel to this title.
        Now, how they balance stealth is a different matter entirely.

        • Elfa

          It’s just too much of a super power and its used for evil far too often by unscrupulous fellows.

    • iceberg265

      15 WARLOCKS IN ARATHI BASIN IS OP NERF WARLOCKS

    • Al’arra

      That could have happened only once, not eight times .. I call you a LIAR.

  • Haselnuss

    So… now we go from Stun Wars to DoT Wars… I don’t believe that this crew is able to do any good balancing. they prooved so many times that they can’t.

  • Poorman

    Like it wasn’t bad enough that i would not be able to play with my friends anymore and now they will nerf the c..p out of my 55 toons aswell. well im not amused one bit by this news 🙁

    • NoQuarter

      Uhh…what?

      • Ethior

        he’s not getting the expansion but his friends are ..

  • IncuBB .

    I have a baaad feeling about this…

  • A;’arra

    Raxus is having a great time tonight …:-)))

  • John Kosto

    I can’t find a single change that I like. Why not higher dps at lvl 60, that’s just stupid

    • prdc

      The resource cost per tick is nice.

  • Shadowofdeath

    From what I just read they are making all the classes on even footing to such an extreme that it will be forcing progression teams to have one of every class to be honest the rest of the changes are also terrible and their solution to level 60 DPS is pathetic, “I know let’s just make the current level 55’s weaker so they can’t run any content until they hit level 60” god awful

    • Ethior

      presumptuous too much, aren’t we 🙂

      • DarkSlayerrrrrr

        “Presuming” at least use the correct version of the word in a proper sentence so you don’t sound like a dumbass

  • Ben Gimson

    I don’t like the look of most of this. Taunts can miss now? Seriously?

    • Cassandrien

      From what it looks like, they intended taunt to miss for PvP, although a few operations bosses will be hard to taunt as well. They also said tanking stance will probably get a free 10 percent accuracy (which effectively put us at 100 percent normally).

      • Ben Gimson

        I get that, but that just means PvP is dictating gameplay for PvEers yet again :/

        Taunts should not miss. Period. If my taunt misses when it HAS to fire then that’s a wipe. Because of a dice roll. Because of PvPers whining because a PvE game isn’t to their liking. Like there aren’t too few tanks already.

        Genuinely the dumbest decision I’ve seen them make yet 🙁

        • Kristioli

          I read 1) 10% accuracy increase on tank stance, 2) no chance to miss under most circumstances, and 3) they could add defense buffs to the boss as a mechanic at certain points in the fight to potentially prevent tank swaps. Sounds quite interesting to me

          • BrianDavion

            they claim it’s not going to adversly affect PVE but I GARENTEE we’ll see a wipe due to this at least once

          • Ben Gimson

            It doesn’t matter if it’s ‘quite interesting’- it works, as is. There’s no reason to change it at all :/

  • Eban

    hmm struggling to see what there is to look forward too in this new expansion,

    Skill trees changed so that leveling your toon to lvl60 you get a few choices but within a week there will be a guide posted somewhere saying which to pick and the rest suck.
    Hybrid skill trees were a good thing, should be encouraged not stopped, nothing worse in a mmo than walking around built the same and doing the same as everyone else.
    And now my dps at lvl55 with 186 gear is going to be the same at lvl 60 with 198 so I have to log in when this is released and level my toon and gear my toon up just so he can do exactly what he already can do. That’s not exactly drawing me in.
    All mobs will die faster…meh nothing worse than a game nerfing NPC’S..
    That bolster on Makeb is already a joke. And the less said about operation bolster the better.

    Surely people don’t want to steam roll all content in the game.
    Difficulty is a good thing and shouldn’t only be reserved for Nightmare operations.
    People complain about endgame content in mmo’s because they get to the endgame too damn fast.

    Biggest issue with Swtor from the beginning is the PVE and PVP clash, this constant battle of making everyone even in some way so that PVP would be fun and fair but in they’re pursuit to achieve this they ruin PVE, Solution to this would have been PVP skill trees and PVE skill trees, separate the 2.
    And Revan meh…just did Dread masters for a year now we have another lightsaber man to go after…this is star wars with aliens and monsters..abit more of an imagination would have been nice.

  • Kai’serevin

    I’m excited about these changes they are making great strides. Yeah maybe because I’m a madness sorc, but I’m not looking 100% towards that. Those of you who are saying well screw this expansion you should look a bit deeper. They HAVEN’T released any other classes so quit your bitching, you’re going off of little to no information and you’re tying in what is now and what they released, wait until the expansion is actually released and then make your opinion.

    • DarkSlayerrrrrr

      Obviously you haven’t checked reddit.com/swtor. ALL OF THE CLASS CHANGES were posted FOUR DAYS AGO. People who’ve checked those and disagree SHOULD. People who’ve watched the twitch live Dev stream and are pissed SHOULD BE. Get your facts straight IDIOT!!

      • Kai’serevin

        You’re basing your facts off of information that could change at anytime. So take your heated ass and go play Call of Duty. If you used your brain and see that nothing you read or see is set and stone. Like I said wait for the expansion to come out then make your opinions on the matter of classes and content. For something you see may actually be really bad and bad things turn out to be great. Ya never know. Now DarkSlayerrr…. calm you little boy tool box in between your legs and see reason because your over heated and over hyped about the expansion is making you look like a total tool and idiot.

  • Zerfinity Zerfinity

    So, with interrupts on a cooldown so humongous that it makes the Death Star look like a small pebble, how are you in 3.0 supposed to battle solo enemies (intended for solo, of course) that use Terminate? Because the decreased TTK will probably not help (most likely it’s just a compensation for the decreased DPS, more or less: they’re not going to dumb down the game). Or will Terminate be used far less frequently now (interrupt, and the mob won’t try it anymore for 16 secs or so, rather than being spammed every 4 seconds by it)?

    • dbaswell

      Terminate being proliferated to so many mobs was one of the things I hated about leveling in 2.0, it seemed around Alderaan that it became so common, and getting a pack with 2 mobs with it was in no way fun, and just produced frustration and a desire for certain classes to have more control mechanics.

  • baddog

    So now that they nerfed level 55 gear, are they nerfing level 55 ops? Absolutely this is a money sink. Boo on them! So now before we can do a level 55 ops we need to be in 186 gear. Well I got 5 toons in level 180 gear, so I have to equip all of them in 186 gear to get the same play? Please do me a favor and don’t create anymore expansions, because you will just screw us out of more money.

    • Shaun Salisbury

      Not nerfing the gear they are just nerfing how effective the stats are.

      • baddog

        No they are not just nerfing stats, read the Q and A.

        Q: Can you explain lower damage at level 60

        A: If you are at 186 gear at 55, when you login your DPS will come down. If you equip the 198 gear and be level 60, your DPS will be similar to current 55s with 186 gear.

        • Shaun Salisbury

          Yes because of how stats effect you they aren’t lowerin the stats themselves the numbers will be the same it just takes more of a Stat to get you back to where you were that is what they are saying please learn to understand the meaning of what they are saying and not just assume.

        • Angelo

          Why nerf lvl 55 stats and have lvl 60 stats do same DPS? For those of you still around from Rise of the Hutt Cartel go live. They did not do this to lvl 50 stats when they introduced the lvl 55 cap. So I am very confused??? Already purchased this expansion, but after I get through the new content. I think I will no longer be a Sub. Shame really been a sub since Live 12/13/2011.

  • Tone Verdun

    For entry level PvPers, this is a good change for them arena type players using bolster. What you so called real PvPers don’t or haven’t gotten, all these stat cuts (to include passive main stat buffs) from new augs and such do not affect open world pvp. one reason I have been saying they need more “OPEN” world PvP dynamics. For the most part, they did the same exact thing in 3.0 to this game that WOW is currently doing (exception WOW did not do a real item squish like they said they would).

    Also, looks like I will be hanging up my Sorc and pulling out my Sniper again with the yummy 270 LoS changes 🙂

    • DarkSlayerrrrrr

      Wow says the BioWare drone. I say this because with that kind of comment you either work for them, you are trolling and don’t really play this game, or you are just a Role playing PVEr who has no idea how PVP in this game works. Honestly who in their RIGHT MIND would want to be NERFED at lvl 55, grind to lvl 60 only to be right back to the damage they WERE DOING PREVIOUSLY??!! The POINT of expansion and grinding to get better gear is to do BETTER and be BETTER than what you previously were and had. This decision by the devs is an act of sheer LAZINESS and the fact that BIOWARE is letting this happen is cooperate cost-cutting BULLSHIT. Who would want accuracy cut, taunts that can miss which will cause a wipe. I see no reason for these changes to basic combat mechanics. The Dosciplines are fine but don’t mess with the basic core combat machanics. Those weren’t boken. I’ll try it out a few days but if I don’t like the changes I’m out.

      • Bye bye tah tah. I’m sure you’ll be missed.

      • Tone Verdun

        Bioware drone, haha, you internet tough guys crack me up. Just because you talk shit behind your made up name doesn’t mean it will change my mind. PvP is a joke in this game and will remain “Stun Wars” in the current condition. They needed a change and again, this is a good one. Also to answer your question on what type of player I am, it’s PvE and PvP, 3 toons over 1500 pvp score since season one.

  • Zeta R.I.P.

    What the mother fuck? All the work I did to gear my fucking dps chars is getting nerfed just so that I can re-grind…..not for more power and dps…..but to come back to what I already had??? Fuck you Bioware! You already have my $20 too. What a shame.

  • me

    what genius at bioware thought that idea up? lets nerf everyone at 55 with 186 gear then when they level up to 60 and grind the 198 gear they’l pull the same numbers they did before the expansion hah ahah ahahha ahha …..

    must be a joke..surely

    • Shaun Salisbury

      They basically said they did it because it was easier to do it that way.

      • Guest

        No, this is what is asked and said:

        Q: Can you explain lower damage at level 60

        A: If you are at 186 gear at 55, when you login your DPS will come down. If you equip the 198 gear and be level 60, your DPS will be similar to current 55s with 186 gear.

        • Shaun Salisbury

          no you don’t get it when they were explaining it in the first place they said they were doing it because it was easier to do.

  • Doona

    This is the worst crap ever! Man..I want my money and time back. Oh well..sucks to be me.

  • Przemysław Narbutt

    Taunt now are able to miss if you don’t have high accuracy – this is
    mostly a PvP change as we want taunts able to miss so there is not a
    huge damage reduction.

    smart, very smart. So now whem you need to take boss from other tank, you will miss and cause a wipe. GJ BW

    • Mac

      This is why tanks are getting the 10% Accuracy Buff, which will take their special attacks accuracy to 110% while they’re in tank stance. This change is meant to stop people like Pyrotech PTs from using their AOE taunt to apply an AOE damage reduction. This will have almost no effect on tanks in tank stance.

  • Haselnuss

    BioWare: SWG players may notice SWTOR’s NGE is on the way!

    Just kidding.

  • sentientomega

    Wow…geniuses at BW want everyone to die every single smegging fight…as if they could possibly break the game further…

  • Areneth

    At least one good info from stream: UI changes 🙂

    Oh and…
    “We also made some changes so that all the mobs in leveling planets etc will now die faster”

    Dafaq does it mean? All mobs die pretty fast on all planets. Stop making game so casual. First disciplines, now that.

    • Lightning

      They nerfed the DPS significantly for level 55’s (and lower I assume). This is to ensure leveling planets don’t get harder because of the DPS nerf.

  • sentientomega

    Just how hard will Oricon be with lvl 55 gear now? As if it wasn’t hard enough…

    • Infernus

      There is only one part of Oricon that I find difficult, but I can see it all being a little more painful now if it’s not adjusted.

  • Those new configurable buff/debuff bars look very nice, let’s hope they get round to implementing them for the raid frame too.

  • Infernus

    Starting to feel like the 12x was a big ol’ bait and switch scam. It got a lot of people to pre-order the expansion (me included) to get all their characters leveled up quick to enjoy playing from 55-60 only to find out after that the expansion appears to be ruining the game little by little with each new announcement. I am not happy with these changes.

    Are the devs so bad at what they do that their only answer to every problem is to nerf/dumb down the content? (Maked is a pathetic shell of itself now) I constantly see logical, well thought out answers to many game problems from the player community….why can’t the devs think of these things? Don’t they actually play the game??

    I’m more of a casual gamer…meaning, I don’t strive for perfection, I don’t constantly check my DPS. I play for fun. It’s not fun to grind for the right gear to be useful at end game content to only have all that time and effort wasted and be told to just do it all over again and for no other reason than it’s easier for the devs to be lazy.

    • sentientomega

      Ikr? I mean, interrupts that will end up only being worth using once in a fight, a taunt that can miss?!

      This reminds me of a note I can imagine BW writing to the community, accomanpied by an evil corporate laugh:

      Dear players, henceforth, every action you take in combat will heal the enemy and damage you, the more you heal and dps the greater the dmg you’ll tank, also, the more you try to tank the bigger your personal armour reduction will be. Love from Bioware.

    • Ethior

      Dude you should really stop being so negative about something you pretend to understand by seeing a part of it’s shadow…

      No one said you won’t be able to clear level 55″End game” content with the stuff you can now. They said that it will probably get a bit harder(something that I see as a plus even thought I have not yet cleared it) and if it is too bad it will be adjusted. So to clear boss X: Y dps per DD might have been required but now since all are doing 10% less damage the boss would require 90% * Y per DD…

      Also it is pretty much common sense that new levels translates to new gear progression and so on.

      Please reserve your “That’s bull crap” judgement for when you can see all that is done and are sober. If you are still dissatisfied express yourself in a more constructive way. Thank you!

      • Infernus

        So, I’m drunk and too stupid to express my (what seemed constructive to me) judgement. Are you kidding me????

        You clearly are the one who doesn’t understand..or maybe you’re just one of the developers hiding behind a screen name having fun insulting others…either way….let’s see…

        ….new levels translate to new progression….yeah, no kidding…there is NO NEW progression though. You get to progress to the same place you’re at now because they are NERFING the current gear. (your numbers are guess work to make your point try and look better).

        3.0 Level 60 gear = 2.10 Level 55 gear. That’s what they said. They are lowering the damage output of level 55 gear in 3.0….but NOT changing the 55 fights. If level 60 is the same as current level 55 that would presumably mean that 60 fights should be on the same level as current 55 fights? In that case why gear up to level 60 anyway..oh yeah, cause my 55 is getting nerfed.

        All this juggling around of changing levels, gear, and probably A LOT of fights in the future when…

        ….All they had to do was add a higher level of gear, higher level of fights and leave the current stuff alone. But that was too hard for them to implement it seems.

  • Areneth

    And about this interrupt change… If cooldown will increase, lockout on interrupted ability should be increased too, right?

    • norman

      That would make sense, so no.

  • Sivis

    My personal feedback on this:

    Likes:
    # The changes to UI, specifically proc glows, buff timers/sorting/filtering, debuff sorting/filtering.
    # Channel changes.
    # Making Alacrity better/useful, always good in my book!
    # Adding raid buffs for all, I like stuff like this. I don’t raid much but its nice to see.

    Dislikes:
    # The DPS change for 55’s and 60. Whoever allowed that change should be given a written warning or fired. I find the change/proposed change (we all know they’ll do it anyway, regardless of feedback) irrelevant and completely different to what it should actually be.
    # I don’t PvP much, but DoT’s not being cleansable in PvP just screams idiocy to me. I’m sure some dev somewhere thinks they’ve done their research and its a brilliant idea, it really isn’t.
    # The interrupt change I’m putting here, because I dislike the change more than I like it. More of a 60/40 dislike really. Especially if lockout of said attack, remains the same.
    # Accuracy again, 60/40. If vendor/obtainable gear reflects the accuracy change, meaning theres an acceptable amount on there then fine. If not and I expect this, then no I will find it rough going.

    I think the main thing here is the DPS change. I literally cannot think of any logical reason to do this ever.

    • Infernus

      You hit the nail on the head…”a logical reason”. There isn’t one..plain and simple.

    • Robert Hindy

      >I don’t PvP much, but DoT’s not being cleansable in PvP just screams idiocy to me. I’m sure some dev somewhere thinks they’ve done their research and its a brilliant idea, it really isn’t.

      This really isn’t a change from current version. Every DOT except Pyrotech’s DOTs are either uncleansible or have a weaker version added when they are cleansed. It slowly worked its way since 2.0: each spec has asked for its DOTs to be uncleansible in one of their 3 Q&A questions.

    • bleeters

      I’m assuming it’s an attempt to keep a lid on the power creep that WoW has suffered to such a drastic extent.

      • Ancaglon

        Yes, that could work, IF they weren’t ALSO changing Interrupts and Cleanses at the same time, and basically waiting for people to scream blue murder about the content it breaks. I have very little confidence in the current development team in being able to do such large scale changes to all existing content without breaking much of it horribly.

  • 4Skyrim .

    “Players at level 60 will do similar DPS as current level 55s while the 55s in 3.0 will do less DPS than current 55s.”

    Hey Dulfy, do they mean entry level 60’s or do they mean the highest tier pve gear will be doing the current level 55 damage? Because it would be a shame to have to grind through a whole new tier of gear just to do the damage that we are doing now.

    • Sivis

      Entry level is implied tbh, else they’d have mentioned end game; I think anyway 🙂

      What they are doing with this change, is removing visual progression to people who’ve played the game prior to the change. New players or ones that haven’t got at getting decent gear, will not notice the change as much.

      It really does make no sense at all and is reminiscent of Blizzards item squish (out now prior to WoD). But BW seem to think its easier for them this way, to do whatever they are planning next. What it does in reality, is show the tech they have just can’t cope with anything complex and they are unwilling to move forward really.

      Makes ya wonder. Regardless I hope they go into more depth with it as its a VERY big thing to do and will cause some serious issues.

  • Przemysław Narbutt

    Guys, take a big breath and think, does it rly matter if the numbers will increase if the content is adjusted? Cmon, this is biggest change in game ever came to us so far, and you are now yelling without any logical aproach. They moved from stone age skill tree to newer and in my opinion better system, but with that they had to rework shitload of stuff, so for me it doesnt matter if i will do 4k dps or 40k as far if content will be good, and i belive it will be.

    • Infernus

      It matters quite a lot actually. The sensible thing would have been for level 55-60 gear to allow for more damage and in turn the mobs would be harder…instead..they’re basically nerfing the whole game, little by little. (Makeb sound familiar to you?) They continue to dumb down the system because they just don’t have a clue what they’re doing. We keep getting the answer of “because it was easier for the devs”. Also…how about all that time people spent to grind for the gear to do that level 55 damage and now they basically have to do it all again. How is that a reward for being a loyal player?

      • Przemysław Narbutt

        I belive you are wrong. They have changed a lot in game now they adjusting it, i dont care about numbers, my epenis is already big enough…. and you have not said a single word about “does it rly matters if you do 4k dps or 40k”? it does not as long as game gives you fun from playing it. for me it will be because i like those new disciplines and it required from devs to adjust nearly everything again, and finally make a proper banalcing in game. Imo they know what they are doing, afterall they are developers, not you.

        • Infernus

          Based on your response to me and the others above, you clearly haven’t thought about this at all. You should care about the numbers. The game is all about “the numbers”. You can’t make a proper 100% balance in any game, trying to do so results in a fail every time…it’s happened in every MMO out there. As for them being “Developers”, that doesn’t make them infallible. Oh and for your shot at me at the end…you don’t know me…you don’t know what I know or how smart I may be. But I can tell you this…I am for damn sure smarter than you.

          • Przemysław Narbutt

            lolz. Im sure of only one thing, dont be sure of anything ;>

            Im done with comments on this site. So many clue less people

    • DarkSlayerrrrrr

      Idiot!! YOU may LIKE the idea of NOT BEING ABLE to run CURRENT operations until you get the new gear to do EXACTLY the SAME DAMAGE you were doing BEFORE. I for one HATE IT. It is a really lazy decision on their part. I hope when they said they were also Nerfing the damage from NPC mobs that it also applies to mobs in operations, if not then we are totally screwed especially now that taunts can MISS!! What kind of BULLSHIT is that!!! I’m guessing the boss can just plug his ears and say “I’m not listening to you tank, I’m just gonna keep pounding your healz, DPS, then come after you, get ready to WIPE my arse!!” LOL. I mean HOW DIFFICULT would it have been to just leave current lvl 55 stats alone, make lvl 60 stats better, make lvl 60 only ops then create a Revan Mode higher than nightmare mode with awesome loot? I mean THAT MAKES SENSE TO ME

      • Przemysław Narbutt

        Im not going to talk to people that start converstaion with me from word idiot.

        • DarkSlayerrrrrr

          You shouldn’t talk AT ALL

          • Sarigar

            The great thing is, “DarkSlayerrrrrrr” with six r’s for extra coolness, for all your pissing and moaning, and tantrum-throwing and name-calling, the deal is done: you’re not going to get what you want, and you have to deal with what’s coming. You’re going to suffer, because you’re an immature asshole. That’s funny to me. 🙂

            • DarkSlayerrrrrr

              Lucky for you you are probably not on my server. However you DO have a point. What’s done is done and they are not going to change a thing

              • Sarigar

                I’m on Ebon Hawk. What are you gonna do, drive your speeder in circles around me, or Force Storm me while I’m checking my mail?

              • DarkSlayerrrrrr

                Nah just hunt you down and endlessly slaughter you til you break your keyboard and rage quit lol

              • Sarigar

                Good luck, I don’t PVP; it tends to attract a lot of terrible human beings. I like to play with good sports, not sociopathic shut-ins who think that leaderboards and gear scores are an actual measure of character and value.

              • DarkSlayerrrrrr

                Ha you are probably one of those weird “shut-in” wacko Role playing PVErs who switch genders pretending to be women hitting on dudes, are married to fifty ppl in-game, and invest TONS of REAL MONEY in game to make up for a shitty real life……….sad and weird sir

              • Sarigar

                You critically hit a straw man for 6530 points of Irrelevant damage. Nice one!

              • DarkSlayerrrrrr

                Rather it looks like I clearly hit a nerve LMAO

      • Ethior

        please, go listen to the stream video. They said plenty of times. We are reducing player damage output(and/or cleanse, interrupt cool downs …) if it makes a fight unreasonably hard we’ll change the fight

        • DarkSlayerrrrrr

          Well we will see. As of now I have no more faith in their changes

    • Imber

      Issue is that they might nerf some things, but they won’t nerf everything (and shouldn’t), so, if your attack and hp is nerfed/not so effective and you don’t farm your gear up (I, for example, can’t and am still running around in my Black Market items, therefor already being weaker than most others), you will be weak link in even lvl 55 tactical fps and it won’t be fun to get wiped out so easily and there’s high chance you’ll get kicked out at the start. That’s not having fun in the game or being considerate of players.

      • Przemysław Narbutt

        Do you rly think devs are so short and narrow minded to think “lets nerf dps, but leave current content as it is now”? Pls…………..

        • DarkSlayerrrrrr

          Have they made any mention of changing centent to match the NERF? Uh….. NO

          • Przemysław Narbutt

            Have you tought about “they dont have to say everything yet”? pls go troll different place.

            • DarkSlayerrrrrr

              I asked the question during the livestream. Answer: NO CHANGES other than Nerfing NPC mobs during normal questing. NO MENTION of anything else to match the NERF. You can literally check out the footage on YouTube now. It would be good for you to do some research before you continue to spout more non-sense

              • macewindy

                And this means that your previous statement was wrong. Thx for helping with that.

                In regards to flashpoints they havent said they have changed it but they also haven’t said they didn’t changed it. So save your breath for than.

                Also plz …. lv55 HM are not hard at all …. blackhole gear is just fine for it. If a 180 geared tank has enough DPS to meet enragetime solo than I guess 2 real dps in the nerfed 3.0 will be able to reach the same numbers.

              • TJWoo

                Can you make a video of your group of 4 in all black hole gear on HM Core Meltdown? Would love to see how it turns out.

          • Infernus

            They did mention making others mobs weaker, but that’s just another problem. The game is going to be so out of balance and not as much fun trying to grind for the same stuff you’ve already done before.

          • macewindy

            Uh ….. YES
            Can you plz fact check stuff before yelling?

        • Ancaglon

          I’ve no idea how short they are, but I do know there’s far fewer of them now than when the game launched, and since the designers of a lot of existing content are no longer in the game, I truly doubt they can fix all the problems they will cause with these changes.

      • DarkSlayerrrrrr

        Well said

    • Ancaglon

      They didn’t HAVE to re-work everything at once (and, with a limited Closed Beta, there will be many game-breaking bugs that won’t be seen till “Early Access”). They’re trying to do the same sorts of things that Blizzard did with a much larger development team and much more open testing, in secret and on a shoestring budget.

      Plenty of people playing SWTOR remember just how badly Sony (SOE) managed to break Star Wars Galaxies with their “Combat Upgrade” and “New Game Enhancement” (CU and NGE), and they basically killed the game. I don’t want that to happen again here.

  • Kazusano

    what if I don’t upgrade to 3.0
    will my lv55 2.0 186 be in fact, just as effective as a lv60 3.0 BiS
    at least, as far as raiding lv55 operations go?

    • DarkSlayerrrrrr

      Probably not

    • Sivis

      You won’t be able to play Kaz, as the launcher will keep forcing you to have the latest version. Or force you to background download etc.

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      They said that level 55 gear will do less damage and level 60 gear will do as much damage as level 55 gear does today. I don’t see any unclarity there but clearly it means that no, you will not be as effective as a level 60 but you will be able to clear the level 55 content, just not roflstomp it like it is now.

      • Ancaglon

        Except for all the content that will be broken with the interrupt and cleanse changes, sure.

    • Ancaglon

      If you don’t buy the expansion, you’ll just be stuck at 55 with 186 gear doing about the same damage as a level 50 in 150 gear does now.

      If you mean you don’t patch to 3.0, you just won’t be able to play at all.

  • Sarigar

    I can see these changes being accepted with grace and good sportsmanship by the community at large. It’s wonderful to be part of a game with so many patient, tolerant, thoughtful players.

    • Sivis

      You win the internet this day! 😛

      • DarkSlayerrrrrr

        More like he’s Charlie-Sheen Bi-Winning the internet today LMAO

    • It’s probably not as bad as it looks, the thoughtful balanced players don’t tend to be as loud. I for one am not too worried about the news so far, and very happy with the new buff tracker and alacrity changes. We’ll see how it plays out come december, and if some of it is real bad, it’ll get tuned quick enough. Bioware has been pretty good at tuning things up and down as needed in the past half year.

  • EyesOfGehenna .

    I wonder about these raid buffs. Will they be useable outside ops groups or can you use them while leveling or doing heroics as well?

    • I expect they’ll be similar to Marauder’s bloodlust, which works just fine in flashpoints and solo content.

  • strejk

    The one thing I don’t understand (and am still hung up on :p) is why they’re doing what they’re doing to cleanses. If they’re worried about dot specs not being viable in pvp (… lol, as if they weren’t running the place already), they could just add that same “your dots are now diamonds!” line Madness and Watchman and whatever else gets that makes them uncleansable. I feel really bad for PVP healers, though. Trying to keep yourself or a tank up with stacks and stacks on uncleansable dots is gonna be impossible.

    Also, 18 sec between interrupts? So I can interrupt one HT and then watch that same sage toss out 7-9 Deliverances before it comes off cd. Sounds like a great idea. Taunts missing? What’s really the harm of letting DPS specced tank-capable classes be able to apply an AOE dmg reduction? I mean, it helps the entire team and doesn’t hinder the other to a ridiculous degree.

    • Ree

      You can also stun and use pushbacks to interrupt the healer. Not to mention you’re not on your own. If your teammates are focussing the healer as well, you’ll have multiple stuns + damage. Just requires some coordination.

      • strejk

        True enough, but that actually requires the ability to focus :p On our server a lot of players seem to think “kill the healer” means run after the tank slapping it over and over, and target markers are just pretty decos.

        • Ree

          Which is what I was referring to with “just requires some coordination”. Which is really hard it seems…

    • DarkSlayerrrrrr

      Wait does this mean we won’t be able to do AOE damage reduction in pvp now with this change some of the time? Well there go the protection points

      • Tanks get 10% free accuracy, so your AOE is safe.

        If you’re not in tank-spec, you’ll miss 5% of the time, and overall protection will be 5% lower, not the end of the world either.

        You’ll probably lose another few % by hitting people who have defenses up that increase miss chance (e.g. evasion). Still the numbers won’t drop all that much.

    • iceberg265

      Yeah I am not so sure about these changes either. Increasing the cd on cleanse and interrupt seems like a really bad idea. The taunt one is especially weird since they are giving tanks a ton of free accuracy anyways so it really won’t make any difference.

    • macewindy

      You will be able to taunt more often so I guess it will be just fine.
      Add to that that your enemy must have more than 10% defense …….. you get the idea? Taunts are really getting buffed also in PvP. Against a tank you might miss a taunt but who really cares about that?

  • jes

    Meh, as long as PVP cross-healing isn’t addressed, PVP will always be terrible.

    • Vriff

      what?…

  • Sarigar

    The most dismaying thing to me is that they’re adding a new tier of augments. Mk 9’s are already very costly, rekitting 13-14 characters with Mk-10’s does not sound like tons of fun. I guess it depends on whether we just need to replace the augments, or the augment slots, as well: if it’s just the augments, that’s a bitter pill, but doable. If we have to redo all the augment slots as well… ouch.

    • Przemysław Narbutt

      If i remember right, you wont be able to put mk-10 augs in mk-9 slot :S and 42k cost of installing mk-10 slot.

      • Sarigar

        That hurts where it hurts the most: in my imaginary wallet.

        • Przemysław Narbutt

          Yup.. :S and im lvling up 16 toons (each advanced class) and because of that i will try to use as much legacy gear i can 😀

          • Sarigar

            I’m feeling particularly salted about this because I JUST finished putting mk-9 slots and augments in my new 55 sorc. But at least he’ll get to be awesome for a month or so!

    • iceberg265

      Very costly? No.

      • Sarigar

        36,000 x14 to add slots is over half a million. Even if you can make the augments, and the kits, that’s very costly to a lot of players, man.

        • holyfrog

          it will probably be like 45k to add the kit. Remember that thr cost goes up for each lvl.

          • Sarigar

            Very true, I was referring to the current cost of mk-9’s, though.

          • TJWoo

            From datamining it appears that it’s 42k per kit and they’ve only added one, MK-10.

        • Ancaglon

          But Icebergy is always right… because to him, it’s not very costly, it isn’t be very costly to anyone.

          • iceberg265

            Considering I play the game less than 10 hours per week and I can afford my own guild ship if I want, I think I’m probably right in this case. And there are people in game far far richer than me who play even less.

        • Al’arra

          For preferred status players it’s 54k, if I’m not mistaken. For MK-12 it may well rise to 90k…

        • iceberg265

          That is a half hour of play time earning credits the hard way.

          • Sarigar

            Explain to me in detail how to reliably earn half a million credits in 30 minutes of played time, and I will follow your instructions to the letter.

            • iceberg265

              My mistake, its actually about an hour to 75mins of play time.
              http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=7579759#post7579759

              • Sarigar

                Well, that’s a bit more realistic. 🙂

              • iceberg265

                Its not speculative numbers, its accurate numbers at the time of my experiment. Also pay particular attention to my “Why you can do better” section. With a little research, you can easily get better results than I did.

          • Unperson

            Wow, you must be one of those hardcore, MLG quicksc0ping pr0s that put the rest of us to shame with your mad skillz, because you earn credits “the hard way”.

            Or… maybe you are just another message board blowhard.

            http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=754943

            Hilarious how they lambasted the OP in that thread for strawmanning because no one ever said you can make 1M per hour… until now, apparently.

            • iceberg265

              I miss typed, sorry. Its actually about an hour to 75mins of play time. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=7579759#post7579759

              • Unperson

                Yeah, that’s more like it and fairly close to what I do when I’m strapped for cash, though I’m usually queued in the meantime and craft attack adrenals or augment kits to sell rather than listing the raw mats. Props for correcting yourself, too.

    • Khadan

      It’s the way it was when it went to 55. Had to jump from mk6 to 9.

      • Sarigar

        Yeah, I know… it’s the bullet we all must bite. 🙂

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      yeh that’s the thing I really hate about a level cap raise…those damn augments and the kits. It will hurt again, just like last time and I will do it cause you need the extra stats for endgame but I will hate it just like last time and probably complain about it a few more times

      • schroudedT

        If you are already in Mk9’s this is probably something with less priority to update.
        Tell you what: We’ll get in real trouble when they start with a new crystal Tier in a future far away from today. Because this means that all the nice colours we got are suddenly crap stats. And THIS will be really expensive to fix. Well, not with the next patch.

        • Ancaglon

          It’s already been stated they won’t increase the +41 on the crystals any further.

        • Sarigar

          I’m still optimistic that in time, crystal colour will become purely cosmetic, and you’ll just be loading the stat you want and choosing from colours you’ve already unlocked. They’ve made noises that they’re working on a wardrobe/appearance tab or other option, so that you can look how you want without having to spend a fortune to pull mods and reslot them when you get a new outfit. Hopefully we will see that next year.

          • baddog

            That is why I like Rift, BW should have done this along time ago.

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          Do you remember how big the difference was between stats on MK-6 and MK-9 augments? It made the MK-6 ones that used to be bis completely laughable. I am expecting the same to happen again.

          • Ancaglon

            But that “increase” will mean f-all. So have fun wasting a lot more money to, ultimately, not even get back to where you started.

        • lazer

          As I understand it, it’s been their intention to keep color crystals cosmetic for a while now (really since they started putting the +41’s in cartel packs). The only change that’s required for them is to add level 10 +41 versions of the original colors that you can currently only get max stats at 50. Think they once thought about removing the stats all together, but that would cause a pretty significant stir.

  • Liron Ben-David

    sucks.

  • Khadan

    My concern is interrupts for tanks. Most abilities that need to be kicked are timed with the interrupt CD. Hopefully there will be utility abilities that lower the CD.

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      maybe finally dps will realise they also have an interrupt and that they can do something with it

      • I think Draxus HM/NiM really got that message through already…

      • Boldeefett Loxx

        As a DPS i’m a bit sick of Tanks criticizing the use of DPS interrupts and anti aggro abilities, fair enough your comment maybe in general and in a PUG there is probably a fair amount of truth in what you say, but I have even had this levelled at me by one or two of my guild Tanks.

        I have pointed out to them that a/ If the DPS in the OP wasn’t using interrupts we would be wiping, b/ That if a DPS uses anti aggro abilities often they will not work if the DPS is out of taunt range and I for one wont be running towards the boss while it is screaming/slamming etc, c/ As a DPS you often find your self in a catch 22 situation with Tanks, it your fault when you pull aggro because your doing too much DPS and when the OP wipes its your fault for not doing enough DPS, sorry Tanks but you cant have it both ways.

        Many Tanks seem to think the only way to control aggro is to use taunts when in fact the simplest way to generate threat is to simply hit the boss after all that’s how us DPS are doing it, take note.

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          I don’t think you should take generalisations personally particularly if you are different, but I play all 3 roles and I DPS more than I tank myself.

          • Svebor

            And why do you generalize as well? What interupts with 18 second cooldown. Heck, increase it to CD of Heroic moment, then it will be very challenging.
            Again, you cant bring out expac by breaking lots of content first and then fixing it “soon”

          • Boldeefett Loxx

            Its something I have wanted to get off my chest for a while now, if you play DPS more than Tank then I assume you understand the dilemma we DPS often find our selves in.

        • R315r4z0r

          I’ve never heard a tank say that before.

  • Turshek

    So funny to see people raging about the DPS changes, when they are needed changes to slow DMG increase and not have in a year or two, characters with 1million HP doing 100k DPS to bosses with thousands of billions HP.
    It’s also made to reduce the gap between post 3.0 lvl 55s in 140-156 gear and old ones in 180 gear because devs know it’s better to have everyone doing the same new content as they have closer DPS than trying to make either one path for everyone but seeing one crowd complaining it’s too easy/hard because of the other crowd or to make 2 separate paths and seeing one crowd abusing the other path to get rewarded more quickly.

  • ManDingoCC6901

    There is quite a bit I like as a healer…
    I love what they did to alacrity and channels. I also like the UI
    changes and proc effects. There is a bunch to be excited for.

    As far as DPS goes, I would agree that the DPS
    was beginning to scale out of control. However, I wish they would have
    found a way to just tone down the increasing scale as opposed to just shifting
    it and thereby nerfing all the DPS. However, I have no doubt that the
    players will overcome this in time.

    Shifting to accuracy and potentially missing
    taunts, I am worried about this regarding tanks. It seems to me they have
    it covered for now with the tank stance setup, but I worry they’ll use this in
    the future to make taunts intentionally hard to hit on a boss in an op.
    That sounds less fun.

    The interrupts and clense changes should be
    pretty adaptable over time, but I agree with others. If they increase the cool down, maybe give us
    a couple more seconds on the caused lockout.
    I don’t know the numbers, but that would seem to help offset the change.

    Regarding easier leveling, this is a
    conundrum. Having a level 55 of every
    advance class, I can say that leveling isn’t really that hard now. You have to pay attention, but it is very
    doable. However, I will also say, OMG I’m
    so freaking tired of it. I wonder if
    this is one reason they are trying to
    speed it up. I think the easiest way
    would have been to sell 12xp on the cartel market. In the end though, this, like Makeb, shouldn’t
    hurt the game much. All the leveling
    exists for the story. The endgame is
    where difficulty comes in. The one
    caveat to that, though, is that people may not know the class they level as
    well if they are less challenged.

    Overall, I guess what continues to bother me
    the most is the concept of balancing everything across the game PvE and
    PvP. The two are always in such
    conflict. Now, all these changes for the
    sake of PvP are really messing with PvE.
    And it’s not just messing with PvE players. They will literally have to redesign several
    pieces of operations and flashpoints as a result of this. I sure hope they don’t miss anything, and I
    hope the coding changes are quasi-clean.
    I really just wish they would either make PvP disciplines or make powers
    function differently based on player effects versus NPC effects (thereby
    separating abilities based on use). Even
    though we’ve seen some of this already, even if it isn’t much, the motives for
    the recent change being to do less balancing class work in the future makes me doubt
    this is a path they’ll take. At least,
    it won’t be a fast path.

    For now I will give the changes 7/10 reserving
    final judgment for when I actually see it in practice. I for sure don’t think they’ve killed the
    game. The doom is not nigh. We’ll have to adapt to a bit, and they’ll
    have to pay attention to stats and what they’ve done to the game and how it
    impacts player usage of the game using their mythical stats. Overtime, 3.0 will get smoothed out and
    become the norm.

    #RevanIsKephess

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      DPS are just crying over their parser numbers. Reality is that a lot of people are roflstomping SM and HM content and I’m guessing that’s not how it was intended.

      • Ancaglon

        Breaking NiM content with the DPS nerf on top of the changes to Cleanse and Interrupts is my major concern, since I have no confidence that this Dev team can actually fix those things in a timely manner — many “complex” operations are already finely balanced on the timings of all 3 aspects (dps, cleanses and interrupts) that will probably never be revisited.

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          Well they did say they might adjust NiM, didn’t they?

          • Svebor

            Dont make us laugh. Do you think devs have slightest idea on how PvE content is working apart from numbers? Cleanses to 12 seconds? Good luck with Nefra/Council (hm/nim). Interupts on 18? Good luck with SaV Infiltration. This changes are mainly because PvP community whine all day long. And speaking of which, good luck interupting healers in WZ now with 18 sec interupt.
            To break it down for you really quick.
            They will first break LOADS of content with this changes, and then they will work on fixing it. Does that make any sense to you?

      • nihil

        Sure? This content is out for ages. Ist only natural that people cut through it like through butter with everyone being at least 180 BIS and tactics that are as natural as changing the pants.
        This is what happens to old content and this content is OLD. This is the real problem.

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          I agree it’s old but at the same time it’s also extremely easy without having bis gear but just commendation gear. The fact that people were doing HMs without using bis gear of the req level should tell you there was more wrong than just age.

          • Heritor

            I hope they get rid of Enrage timers. AT 55 the game was reminding me of WoW during the Wrath of the Lich King. DPS was doing HUGE numbers and all the fights were boiling down to a DPS race.

            When Enrage timers are put into your raids and Hard Modes thats means your DPS is out of control. DPS can whine all they like but the damage is absurd at this moment.

  • holyfrog

    i dont the reson they are neffing DPS. The content is going up so why not let the DPs go up with it? Harder bosses need higher DPS. What is up with this?

    • Strew

      It’s only numbers jeez… God damn it’s full of shitty cry babies everywhere complaining for nothing it won’t change how you play your class !

      • Nemo

        you have obviously never tried a hardmode, go back to rp.

        • DarkSlayerrrrrr

          You trolling yourself is freaking halirious

          • Nemo

            lawwwwwwwl, say hi to nokiko for me.

        • Strew

          I’m a pvp player you idiot and a very good one go back to your boring dailies and repetitive rehash nightmare mode

          • baddog

            Then go back to your boring Hutt Ball!

            • Strew

              I will do that with great pleasure 😉

    • Shaun Salisbury

      They explained why because it’s easier to adjust players then it is to adjust everything else.

    • R315r4z0r

      I personally don’t see the issue with downgrading DPS. Think of it like this: old content will still retain some challenge even in your high-end gear.

      The biggest issue with globally increasing the effectiveness of players with each new tier of gear is that it also makes old content obsolete.

      • Ancaglon

        Whereas this makes old content nonviable at the intended level. What an improvement!

  • nihil

    First of all: F@ck pvp, I can practically smell that this will again Impact PVE. Hope not!, though…
    2) Why making us weaker? Shall we have to run Oricon H2 in Groups until we got decent equip again? Why? Wheres the Point in nerfing everything … unless they are going to force us to live on old Content as part of the new endgame again? Oricon Dailies for Basic Comms?
    3) Good idea to make alacrity more viable. And with a big “maybe” the new raidbuffs are a good thing.
    But Overall: We will be crippled even more than with the last update.
    If this all turns to be out to be mere streamlining of programming work, recycling of content and another bunch of boring “tactical” flashpoints with 2 pseudo-operations that become boring after three months then I will problably not last another year in this game.

    • Strew

      Pvp is the best thing is this game the rest is boring at least it has been for a year

    • Shaun Salisbury

      They weakened players because it’s easier than adjusting everything else.

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      I did Oricon with 140 gear the first time and managed just fine. My guess is that the downtuned 186 gear will still be better than the original 140 gear we got from the Makeb vendor.

      • Ancaglon

        Which will almost certainly require level 57 or so. Doing Oricon with 140 gear (or even 156 gear assuming they make the old “basic” gear available for the “new” basic comms) with the 3.0 nerfs is certainly not guaranteed to be “better”.

  • Guest

    Catering to PvP once again fucks over PvE. Way to go EA.

    • Kalyu

      Shut up you don’t know shit

    • theseconddavid

      PvE players are shit, so no harm done.

      • EyesOfGehenna .

        Aside from the fact that most players are pve players so without them you wouldn’t have a game to play to begin with…but hey, details right 😉

      • darkfather

        So 70% of the game is shit? PVP is a minority part of the game. Your comment is flat out nonsense and isn’t even realistic.

      • Christopher Luther

        And PvPers are dicks.

        Actually, it’s just you.

  • DarkSlayerrrrrr

    In the words of AngryJoe, BioWare “You done F***ed it up!”

  • Guest

    Hey Dulfy – this is unrelated, but do you think that Bioware will add Persons of Note, Organizations, Species, etc. codex one earns across their legacy to the planetary section of the Legacy tab? Right now they only have Lore Objects and Bestiary, I believe

  • kurwa ktos !!!

    patch 3.0 ====> END of SWToR !!!!!!!!

    • Strew

      Good Luck with that won’t happen

  • Mr Popo’s Troll

    Listen up Maggots, Popo’s about to teach you the pecking order. Let’s begin: SWTOR DEVs, the dirt, the worms that craw in the dirt, Popo’s stool, Kami, then Popo. Any questions?

  • Guest

    What’s the point of raising the level cap if everyone’s just going to have the same effectiveness they did at level 55 when they get there?

    And now tanks have to squeeze another stat in just to make sure their taunts connect?

    I don’t think the good at all outweighs the bad here.

  • userleftyourchannel

    3.0 is a total failure in terms of respecting community voice in regard of pve, and desired chnages/bug fixes. Its negating the voice of paying customers and forcing a nerf that will last a few months before ppl get new best gear and lvl 60. Again, the all knowing devs provide unwanted shit for all (but charging real money for it).

  • Guest

    This news did a pretty good job of killing my enthusiasm for the new expansion.

    • Argaria

      Same feeling exactly. My DPS won’t become anything better with 5 new levels. Instead, I must re-grind all gear again. Sucks.

      • EyesOfGehenna .

        if you really think about it, it makes no difference at all. The only thing you’ll miss out on are bigger numbers on your parsers but you’ll still need to get new gear for the new content as before. Just a matter of point of view really, nothing more.

        • Sivis

          Not really Geh. Think of it this way: you load in 3.0, do less dmg overall, are expected to leve to 60 doing less dmg and missing alot. You finally reach 60, only to find your just doing the same dmg (all be it slightly more) as you did at 55 and your having to get more gear again.

          You then find your hp has gone up, dmg slightly, but your crippled acc wise. You then have to get acc augments to fill the unecessary -acc void that the devs think should be there.

          It completely kills progression for people that’ve been here long enough. Makes no sense, gameplay wise or business wise. So I’m not sure what thy hope to achieve by doing this.

          Theres also the inevitable issue of 60-65 in a year or 2. As BW have plainly spelled out, this way is easier for them (aka they cannot handle doing anything more/do not want to spend the time doing so) this way. So are we going to see lvl 60’s doing crappier dmg, hit 65 and find they do the same dmg -again-?

          Doesn’t bode well and this comes to mind “why fix whats not broken”.

  • gordon freeman

    raid buffs is a horrible idea for many reasons: 1) unranked pvp queues that pick players almost randomly gives unpredictable advantages. 2) this change encourages all groups to have one of each adv class, which makes it even more time consuming to form the optimum group (ruining the ease of group playability). 3) Bioware is overcomplicating things for the sake of calling it an update “feature”

  • Guest

    Some of these changes it seems like they added just to be dicks.

    Chance of missing on a taunt? Longer cool down on interrupts? Really?

    And explain to me again how it’s less work to nerf us and THEN have to nerf all mobs on a case by case basis, instead of keeping us the same and making mobs tougher on a case by case basis?

    • Ancaglon

      Agreed 100%. This is just setting themselves up to fail.

  • Argaria

    I feel for pve healers in 3.0. With increased cooldown on cleanse, lots of shitty debuff icons coming from bloodthirst-like utilities given each class, and no plans to improve raid frame. Now try to be the smart guy and cleanse Tyran’s Death Mark in time…

    Changes made for 3.0, obviously made for pvp are going to hit pve players pretty hard. No real advancement with new 5 levels, forced gear grind just to regain what we already have, increased cooldowns on cleanse and iterrupts. And why I have a feeling, that they don’t know thier own game? They talk about df/dp nim, fine. But do they realise that recent changes will make last boss of EC NIM virtually impossible? (Stuck at the very beginning.) Cartel Warlords NIM? I’m pretty sure more examples like that…

    I find pvp fun, but pve is still vast majority of the game. Decision to tailor majority for fun of minority seems pretty weird.Plus that uneasy feeling, that there isn’t much “given” with 3.0, but so much is being “taken”. And they want us to pay for it…

  • IncuBB .

    Ilove this “new” accuracy buff for tanks at the cost of DPS loss…
    Yeah… Like tanks didn’t suffer enough from DPS loss becouse ITS ALREADY IN TANK STANCE (-5% damage).

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      So maybe it’s part of the perks of the tank stance. Not sure if we will lose more dps. That’s not actually clear.

    • iceberg265

      Depending on the %s this could actually be a buff to tank DPS though. Because accuracy is your single most important offensive stat anyways.

  • iceberg265

    Surprised no one is talking about the “NiM DF/DP being rolled into 60 end game thing. I am seriously pretty pissed at this. Depending on how this is implemented, this may be what causes me to quit this game. DF/DP have been recycled as current content for over a year already, and I will quit raiding before I run them as current content anymore.

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      I don’t see the problem. EC NiM is still a challenge for level 55s today and it’s a level 50 raid. What will happen with DF/DP NiM is gonna be along the same lines except the might actually drop some endgame gear or comms for level 60 but as I understand it you can ignore it completely as the new ops will give you all the gear drops already. This is just in addition to that as I read it.

      • iceberg265

        I’m hoping its something like “NiM DF/DP gear is almost as good as entry raid gear so you can do them to pick up a few missing pieces if you wish”, I would be OK with that. I am not OK with them scaling it up to 60 and calling it new content.

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          that’s not what I get from that. I don’t think they’re upscaling it to 60 but I do think they will be challenging at level 55 even with level 60 gear. The down tuning of stats also makes sure of that.

          • R315r4z0r

            Exactly. It’s going to essentially be the EC NiM of 3.0.

            EC NiM is a level 50 ops that is still a challenge to geared level 55s. However, it doesn’t drop any level 55 gear. So, basically what they are saying is that DF and DP NiM are still going to be level 55 ops, but are also still going to be a challenge for level 60 players. And as a bonus, they may include level 60 gear drops just to keep it as a viable endgame operation.

  • Euclid

    Read closely: +10% accuracy buff for tanks = 110% accuracy on the taunt skill. It won’t miss in PvE anymore than dps miss now.

    The other changes (such as dps and cleansing) WILL affect some of the fights that have been out for a very long time and will be 5 levels below the cap… but they’ve been out a very long time and will be 5 levels below the cap. I’m sure that the new PvE fights will take all of the changes into account.

    Games need to change over time. SWTOR is no different. Every expansion and change has been met with the same doom and gloom I’m reading here. Relax and see what happens you guys. Much of what is fun about a game is discovery. How do I need to optimize my stats or my abilities? How do I use the tools I have? You’re not having anything taken away. You’re playing an online game and being presented new challenges. It isn’t a game if you just roll through all the content on autopilot.

    • Guest

      There’s always someone like this with every nerf and somehow, after every implementation, it never turns out quite as rosy as they paint it.

      We’re getting a level cap increase that’s going to put us right back where we already were, only we have to waste five levels worth of extra time to accomplish it. So essentially, they’re expanding the game and giving us, what, a Revan statue? How about they keep the tacky giant statue and I’ll keep playing the game as it is without the frustration?

      Spin it as you like, busy work and an overall downgrade are NOT a positive scenario.

      • Guest

        Oh and that’s not even mentioning how dishonest they were selling the expansion for a few weeks, marketing it solely as a content upgrade with a level increase and THEN dropping this in our laps when it’s too late for a lot of us to make a fully informed decision and get our money back. There’s no way I would have supported this by pre-ordering had I known we weren’t getting the full story.

      • disqus_stEzfEoBny

        Then unsub and fuck off. No one likes you.

        • Guest

          Aren’t you the articulate one? Try typing your next response with two hands instead.

        • Ben Gimson

          The irony.

    • R315r4z0r

      Ok, but unlike a DPS missing, a missed Taunt can cause a raid wipe. Not saying it will be common. I’m just pointing out that that is a bad comparison to make.

      • Ancaglon

        Right now, Sage and Sorc healers have a talent that gives +3% force accuracy. With it being removed, they will have a 9% chance of missing an interrupt on a Champion mob — and with interrupts being on a much longer cooldown, don’t expect anyone else to be able to cover

        If you love these changes, have fun stacking pointless stats or wiping endlessly thanks to the random number generators.

  • Zan

    As a raid healer…biggest buzz kill ever. Pretty much only staying subbed for my guild right now, and if that drops I’m gone. I dont have to put up with this crap.

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      I am also a raid healer and I actually like the changes. I wonder what you’re talking about.

      • Ancaglon

        Oh, so you enjoy being unable to do stuff that you can do right now until you spend a few months gearing back up to the cap? I could smash your kneecaps and you can also enjoy learning to walk again, if that’s the sort of thing you’re into.

    • Varza

      I agree. I dont really like what they are doing to the game.

  • Cadbane – bastion

    I will never understand how swtors community just cries instead of adapting to changes. Pro tip: humans have been adapting and evolving for centuries. Or as ur fathers should have told you growing up: grow a pair and man the f. Up.

    • userleftyourchannel

      what adapting are you talking about? maybe you want to adapt if they delete your chars, gear, skills, experience too? what sad kind of Bioware fanboy are you? obviously we have no obligation whatsoever to agree on the insulting changes they serve us while we PAID for the game

      • Strew

        It really is adapting what kind of mindset are you in thinking they any mmo would remove skills experience chars and gear ? This really is adapting to the new disciplines system wich looks great by the way And I’m really looking forward the cleanse CC part will put more teamplay and at the same time remove the ammount of CC poeple have been crying that there is too many of them thank god they didn’t seem to have played WOW before the Wod changes..Also people keep crying that taunt will miss in ops no they won’t tanks get 10 % accuracy in tank stance like they said to bring them to 100% this is mostly a pvp change.

        • userleftyourchannel

          Though my a little exagerrated comparisons were intended to rather emphasize the false “adaptation” praise, they are effectively removing your gear at least – anything you fought for 180s rating will be worthless after the expansion. You will get 186 almost effortlessly. Also, you will lose your experience not technically, but by what you will be able to do on lvl 60 – you will be now much weaker than with current game mechanics, only only comparable to what you were before IF you spend (and SUB FOR) another half a year getting new ultimate comms/gear. So they are indeed effecively “removing the work you put into becoming a stronger char, more able to handle the fights that awaited you”. You sir should stop having a fanboy-slave-mindset that is eager to accept anything the devs throw at you. We have the right to defend what we possess. The voice of a paying customer should be the voice that the devs fear, not the other way around, never.

          • R315r4z0r

            That’s not an issue at all. Welcome to the world of MMO expansions. They did this exact same thing when 2.0 launched. Dread Guard gear was made completely useless after a few hours of playing on Makeb.

            • Ancaglon

              But you were pretty much EXACTLY as effective at all the content that existed before 2.0 launched; this time, when 3.0 comes live, you will be much weaker against EXISTING content, and level 55 content will only be as easy as it is now when you’ve got to 60 and finished grinding your gear.

              Plus, of course, your interrupts and cleanses weren’t changed with no rebalancing of the existing content to match.

    • R315r4z0r

      Adapting to changes is not the same thing when their is old content that these changes overlap. If they said they were going to change the old content that keep the pace with the changes, that’s a different story. But they didn’t. They said they are going to leave it the same and fix it as problems come up.

      You can bet money that within the first few weeks there are going to be a number of changes to ops bosses with required DoT cleanses.

      • Ancaglon

        And interrupts; not just in Ops bosses but practically every single major boss fight in your class stories requires you to interrupt or get one-shotted.

        Get your class story levelling done now, because it’ll all be f*cked for weeks/months till they go back and fix it all.

  • cercia

    If a few of these changes are put in play especially the cleanse and interrupt , i really hope that they are going to go back and set all the debuffs and casts to match the new timers for the older raids, or raiding is gonna go down the pan.
    As a raid healer things are hard enough to deal with in a few HM/NIM operations as far as cleansing but not impossible … implementing the above changes will make alacrity a priority stat for many classes just so we can keep up ….. and GL killing council if this does happen can anyone say deathmark wipes ….. so in conclusion … if this is done right and every operation is scaled or have debuffs removed and so on ….great sounds good

    but if past is anything to go by it wont be done right and raiding is gonna be hard going even for the most experienced of us.
    meaning we wont be able to do the older ops till 3.1/3.2 patch

    There are many aspects of SWTOR that cater to everyone which is why its so addictive there is always something new to do …. but dev team .. if you get this wrong your gonna have alot of empty servers

    and being 5 levels above the older content wont make a blind bit of difference if the raid is dieing because of things we cant cleanse/interrupt so no EC reruns

    but time will tell

    • cercia

      also the FAQ on the SWTOR website should also include the question

      “how do we get our money back?”

      • Varza

        here here!

  • disqus_stEzfEoBny

    I love how the Know-it-alls are out in force shouting at the top of there lungs at how horrible the mechanics changing is going to affect their game play. The game is still going to handle more or less the same, with some improvements, and/or adjustments. How about you doom and gloom it when you actually see it implemented, instead of freaking out a month before release on how bad it’s going to be. You know, people came into SWTOR with really high expectations that they made up in their head. When they got through the story and there wasn’t 15 operations and 30 FP’s they all started bitching about “content” and unsubbed. Anyone that stuck with this game knows that within a few months, these concerns were dealt with, especially after RotHC. No one knows the problems with SWTOR better than Bioware, and I trust these implements are based entirely off of that knowledge. I know about 500 of you keyboard warriors that pretend to be know it all developers are going to have a hay day with that statement, but since you live in fantasy land, you can go hug a tree.

    • Guest

      ^^^ If Fox News had an MMO segment.

    • Argaria

      Except, that being given opportunity to pay for 5 levels without real advancement is “a little” disappointment, isn’t it? Being forced to repeat gear grind, just to land back at the place where we already are today, it’s “a little” disappointment, isn’t it?

      • firebrand23

        you want this to turn into WoW, where you see 6 digit numbers on you health bar and 5 digit and up numbers when you attack?

        • Natebird103

          Actually with the last patch for wow that all went away and they made wow harder too

        • Dannielle Sommers

          i actually think BW is following wow too much i play this cause its different from wow. i guess the joke was me then wasnt it

      • Strew

        I’m sure you will have fun doing the new ops and stuff even if the number are near the same it’s new content it’s only number Wow just did the same and I doubt all the players left because they got all their stats and value numbers tuned down

    • Mick

      Agreed… Keep your panties dry people, most classes are going to have one or two significant ability buffs and changes changes in 3.0… and like they have in the past, classes that are way too OP will get nerfed. Stay calm and patient instead of screaming that the end is near when you have so little information to decide that from.

    • Flurfle

      Why is it that anyone who has a different opinion from those that believe Bioware can do no wrong are all “know-it-alls” and “keyboard warriors”. Why are you classified as any less of a know-it-all.

      With all that said, I love playing, I am just not sure I will love playing with the direction the game is going. Galactic Starfighter (do people even still play it?), Strongholds (still no clue why these exist), and now a 5 level expansion where I will have the exact same DPS and power after I reach the end…

  • Guest

    I come back to the game just for the PvP, as well as many others. And to have these significant changes not be directly addressed to how PvP is going to turn out makes me worried for its future. I mean if you are going to make an expansion so game changing at least develop the game entirely not partially.

    • R315r4z0r

      You kidding? They said they aren’t directly addressed to PvP but that’s a damn lie. 90% of all these changes mainly come out of PvP balance tweaking. Notice how most of their examples they draw from are PvP related?

      Taunts and accuracy, cleanses and DoTs, interrupt cooldowns. All these apply more directly to tweaking PvP and just happen to have side effects in PvE.

      I’m personally sick of PvP dictating the major combat changes in the game. I mean, I get it, I have PvP toons. But I also have PvE toons too. But I keep them separated for a reason.

      • Dannielle Sommers

        i agree with you on this it was one of the reasons why i started to hate WoW because pvp was starting to more priority over pve

      • Heist 101

        Having something exploited in pvp can drive people to quit so they try and get that right first bc my guessing is that they can ultimately tweak NPC’s in PVE to fit the classes without the NPC’s complaining and quitting if u kno wat I mean. If they made everything for PVE first then then “mended” player bug reports then yea pvp would be borked and exploited like it used to be in 2012. Point is pvp class balancing #1 then PVE mechanics #2, I’m not %100 on that but it’s my best guess.

      • Lumi

        “I’m personally sick of PvP dictating the major combat changes in the game.”

        Welcome to MMO’s…

        PvP ALWAYS dictates major combat changes, no matter what the game is, no matter who the developer is. There are plenty of “player vs player” games out there, basically any game where two or more players play against each other, and a lot of single player games (player vs everything.)

        Those kinds of games require very little in terms of balancing because they only have to focus on that one aspect, but the same cannot be said for MMO’s which offer both. Therefor they must be balanced for both and usually takes some creative thinking on the developers parts. NO MMO IN HISTORY has been able to make PVE changes that don’t impact PVP and vice versa.

        PvP players are notorious for thinking outside the box, whereas most PVE content have certain ways of doing things and the outcome is always fixed. The sheer complexities of 8 classes and their myriad of talents, skills, and varying skill levels ensures that PvP will forever decide what future changes will be required.

        Sorry, boss – Get used to it

  • Baddie

    This game will die after 3.0. Horrible. All of it.

    • Strew

      Good luck with that won’t happen

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      Just cause you may quit doesn’t mean the game will die. Don’t overestimate your importance to the game.

  • Squigglezz

    I love how people failed to notice that his 198 gear was not optomized at all, and that even with less cunning his damage is higher. Also the taunt can miss is for the dps ass hats in pvp that like to get extra medals. Taunts will work fine if you are an actual tank.

    • Christopher Luther

      Making enemies randomly do less damage in a big melee doesn’t seem like an asshat thing to do. It seems like a logical thing to do.

      Of course, that’s why I don’t PvP.

  • Shawn Hargrave

    Not terribly impressed this month thier supose to shocase this discpline for all classes. So far im getting an swg nge vibe.

    • Cassandrien

      Nowhere near a NGE vibe. NGE revamp the SWG gameplay into a brand new MMO basically. This is not the case here. However, most people hear of “expansion” and new and improved but the fact is, the numbers needs to be changed to be effective and this is what they are doing. 1 Step back and 2 step forward type of thing, just people don’t like the 1 step back and ignores the 2 step forward.

      • ewokingdead

        look at his post history he is a troll for 3 years

        • Guest

          Okay, broken record, we get it.

          • Shawn Hargrave

            dont mind my stalker hes been doing it for 3 years every time i post he thinks its to him lol

            • ewokingdead

              i don’t care who your posts are to i’m just here to inform everyone you are a troll.

              Unlike you i know how post historys work. I haven’t even been playing SWTOr for 3 years let alone post replies to you.

              Every prediction you have made about SWTOR has been wrong. YOu are the very defintion of a failure.

              • Shawn Hargrave

                Thank you for proving my point about obsession here. This is the definition of stalking and the obsession my god WOW

              • ewokingdead

                yeah… 3 years of posting how much you hate SWTOR that is obsession

              • Shawn Hargrave

                What i know is this i posted my view on the topic. I was then attacked by you having never said a word to you. Then you spam every post with im a troll and stuff that quite honestly at this point is getting old and no one other then you gives a shit about. Youve openly said your looking at my fb and posting history and anytime i make a post your re spamming the same bit over and over.

                Do you really think anyone cares about this honestly? They just see me getting stalked and respaming of the same bit.

                Im not trolling you or anyone here. Thiers no encoded message to you when i post here. jesus this is out there

              • ewokingdead

                your “view” is nothing more then concern trolling. You are trying to act as if you care about the game in order to troll others.

                I have read your post history and i am simply expressing my Opinion about you and your posts.

                How dare you try and say i can’t express my opinion.

                Is your post history wrong? Did you not say that SWTOR was a Piece of shit and it was going to shut down as soon as it goes F2P?

                If you dont’ care why do you keep replying?

              • mememememe

                ewokingdead is the troll here. He has no idea about any mmo. Swtor was probably his first…. To say SWG was one of the worst mmo of all time is a HUGE TROLL ALERT. Fucking idiot.

              • Mr Popo’s Troll

                Wow …..creepy lol maybe he’s a fan. You know what they say, haters are just secret lovers LMAO. Good luck

        • Me

          Christ, you are at least as bad as he is if not worse. Spam every post, sometimes multiple times. We got it, you don’t like this guy.

          • Shawn Hargrave

            Ive had to deal with this guy on other game sites. Im not trolling he just think i am. All i did was post on the topic and like every where else its this stalking shit LOL.

            • ewokingdead

              are you now going to say you haven’t been trolling SWTOR for 3 years?

          • ewokingdead

            wow even using the “Guest” feautre of disqus to sockpuppet your posts huh Shawn. good try but fail

            • Shawn Hargrave

              oooook……..wow better lock my doors here

      • Shawn Hargrave

        just an opinion and we dont really know either way at this point.

      • Mr Popo’s Troll

        Excuse me but what exactly does NGE mean?

      • Heist 101

        I agree.. I’m sure the devs have a forward plan and they see the rants posted by people the way children don’t understand the cookie jar is for after dinner.. There was a guy that wrote a book about a statistic study on how offering a toddler 1 marshmallow now or 0 marshmallows now but get two 15 minutes later can detect higher intelligence expected later in his/her life. Idk how credible it was but it seemed kind of worth mentioning here bc players cannot see BW’s executive plans/charts for the coming months and years and start speculating immediately.

        • Cassandrien

          I get the study you were talking about. That study doesn’t really show intelligence but more if the child has self control to see the benefits. Unfortunately, self-control is lacking on the Internet, there is no such thing. But yes, I agree the power creep that devs gave a bit too much in 2.6 and onward needs to be curtailed, mostly for PvP and a bit for PvE. Imagine new ops say in 3.5, with new tier of gear, that’ll increase the current power but they need to control how much it spikes. Better take medicine now than a surgery later, basically.

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      At the same time we also don’t know what’s happening on the pts for the closed beta, so perhaps they are making adjustments still before releasing more info

      • ewokingdead

        ignore him he’s a troll, just look at his post history over the past 3 years. Nothing SWTOR has done he has liked. He is just trying to concern troll now.

    • ewokingdead

      of course you’re not because you’re a troll. Anyone who looks at your post history sees you have done nothing but say how much you hate this game for the past 3 years.

      Funny that you bring up SWG and NGE sorry this game is much better.

      • Shawn Hargrave

        Hello stalker make sure you stay within 500 feet at all times…

        • ewokingdead

          call me what you want doesn’t change the fact you are just a troll who is upset SWG failed and SWTOR is doing better then SWG ever could.

          • NFR

            lol twat…. of course its better.. 2011 game vs a 2002 game? get a grip.

    • Adam baum
  • sentientomega

    With regard to the interrupt CD increase, one final question? How to beat Commander Zaoron on Oricon when he’s already hard enough without said CD increase?

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      you have more than one skill generally that can interrupt. You can use a tank companion and you can kite. Alacrity reduces the cooldown in 3.0 so you can lower that cd a bit anyway and also your other skills like overload and force choke and stuns will have a lower cd because of it. Truly, this isn’t the end of the world.

      • IncuBB .

        And every class will stack alacrity? Don’t make me laugh…

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          Don’t be silly. Each class is different of course. I am just giving some general options. Pick the right one for the right class. I never suggested that all these ideas work equally well for each class. That’s just your asssumption.

          • Ancaglon

            So how many Cartel Coins did you pay for your rose-tinted spectacles and complete lack of experience with the way this dev team works?

      • sentientomega

        Now I come to think of it, would 55s in 3.0 be easier to kill? It is no longer the highest attainable level after all.

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          The thing is it that normally when you get to oricon you have relatively low gear and able to beat them. I would think that 186 gear will now be easy to get but even with the dps down tune it probably still is better than the 140-146 gear that you normally would arrive with on Oricon, so all in all I suspect that yes, Oricon will be easier to do even at level 55

      • Christopher Luther

        I’m only seeing a reduction in GCD and internal cooldowns, like procs from Ion Gas Cylinder or the Shadow/Assassin stances. Nothing about ability cooldown.

  • Konoha the Wiper

    “Augments are no longer free stats”
    Great now players are forced to either craft their own or pay large sums to other crafters (I already do but I’m sure not everyone does, but are now being forces to because it is included in required gear)

    • Iron-Clad

      You got this backwards. Currently, Augments are 100% required; it is a raw point for point boost for every stat you get in an augment. Bolster currently ignores augments entirely: if you take two people with identical gear, except one is augged and the other isn’t, the one with augs will have bolstered stats that are 448 primary stat and 280 endurance higher than the person without augs. With the new system, bolster will take into account any augments you do not have, giving you stats for any missing augments (just not as much as an actual augment would).

      Accordingly, augments are less important in 3.0 pvp than they are in 2.0 pvp, a change that is decreasing the strict necessity of having full augment.

  • versa

    why is the closed beta only for people on the harbinger ? what are the rest of us chopped liver ?

    • Mick

      There’s still a month until launch.. like any beta testing, there will be multiple waves of invites sent out. And if you don’t get one, then you don’t get one. They said in the disciplines stream that they want to grab a broad pool of samples for feedback… meaning the best progression raid groups and pvp teams all the way down to Joe ” permabaddie-one-day-a-week-pvper” Snuffy have a chance to get invites. Patience man, patience.

      • ewokingdead

        i think they did say that this is going to be a closed beta all the way up till release. They don’t want to spoil any of the story elements in it.

    • Chex

      Invites have gone out to people not on Harbinger 🙂

  • IncuBB .

    I really have a weird thing in my head…
    I can see it as if it was real:

    Dev number 1 – Dammit!! People don’t use alacrity! WHAT SHOULD WE DO!!!???
    Dev number 2 – Calm yourself, weakling!!! “slap” We will FORCE them!
    Dev number 1 – “sniveling voice” But how can we do that? Only healers use it….
    Dev number 3 – “hysterical scream” Tank refuse to use accuracy!!! ABANDON SHIIIIP!!!!
    Dev number 1 – “punch 3rd in a nuts” Shut up!!! CALM YOURSELVES ALL OF YOU!!!
    Dev number 1 – “evil laugh” I have a plan…

    • Rushz

      Somehow I feel the same way with accuracy for tanks.

      • EyesOfGehenna .

        Oh you mean the 10% accuracy boost tanks get so they don’t have to stack accuracy in PvE.

        • IncuBB .

          Yeah. I mean accuracy buff with damage nerf. Yep. You got it.

          • Keks

            no he means the defense buff some OPS bosses “might” get and the awesome and very much needed ability to miss taunts were missing until now.

          • EyesOfGehenna .

            I haven’t seen the complete rework of the tank stance but it goes without saying that as dps is brought down for dps classes, it’s not strange that tanks also need to be tempered or holding aggro will be too easy. I think you guys are reading too much into this because you make conclusions without seeing the bigger picture

            • Keks

              I’m pretty sure the reduced damage is there to break even with the damage increase from not missing. (I mean I wouldn’t complain about getting some more DPS even at the cost of reducing the Aggro multiplier if making aggression to easy is the problem (which i doubt)), it’s already pretty easy anyway without missing in the pull it’ll become trivial, all you need it Taunt at the right time, the Problem is that those special bosses they “might” implement with increased defense can now avoid your taunt randomly making your experience randomly “awesome”.

  • Estranged

    Read comprehension, a lost art.

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      Reading comprehension but yeah…

  • Lets be civil and not call each other trolls here. 😀

    • ewokingdead

      what about the really obvious trolls? the ones who have done nothing but troll the game for 3 years? you know the ones saying the talent changes are the same as SWG NGE?

      • IncuBB .

        Not when game start trolling you, man…

        • ewokingdead

          huh?

    • Holyfrog

      (Looks at Dulfy) Troll. (Points at her chin) Trroooollll! (Covers mouth with hand) 😉

      Love you lots Dulfy, please don’t hunt me down and smash my laptop.

  • Swalsugmass

    Question: How is alacrity going to effect Arsenal Bounty Hunters?

    • sentientomega

      Abilities for which that spec finds useful (eg tracer missile, unload and power shot) should have a lower activation and faster channel times.

      • Swalsugmass

        That I understand but as it stands the faster we cast tracer missile the faster we over heat so my question is if alacrity speeds up your resource regeneration then does that mean it will speed up our heat dissipation?

        • tele’an

          That’s what resource regeneration means to you as your resource is a reverse of the trooper’s. For this, instead of viewing your resource as the heat, view in as the empty space on your bar; so resource regen means that that empty space will return faster.

          • Swalsugmass

            I hope that is the case. Would of been nice to of had a more explained answer to the alacrity changes on the classes that are mechanically different.

  • Vincera

    After reading about all these changes, it feels like my 180-geared 55 Tank Juggernaut will play like my old 140-geared Tank Guardian… except with lower DPS and higher accuracy. Is this the aim, to keep wearing down the current endgame edge to make us re-earn it AGAIN?

    Bearing these changes in mind, do tanks switch to augments with alacrity for 3.0, at the expense of defense/absorb/shield? How significant is the impact on damage mitigation, and can we compensate with increased alacrity?

    How/why would a taunt MISS its target?!

    Bleh. /endrant

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      Then you need to check your reading skills because it certainly doesn’t say what you seem to think. Oh and taunts used to be able to miss in the past also, so it’s not something that’s new to the game.

      • Vincera

        Thanks, I’ll have another look. As for taunts, I’ll have to take your word for it as I can’t recall a specific instance of my taunts failing.

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          Read the patch notes for 2.0 It says specifically that taunts can no longer miss. As for 3.0 tanks also get a 10% accuracy bonus it says, which means that tanks do not have to stack accuracy. All DPS classes get lower DPS overall so it goes without saying that the tanks need to be nerfed on DPS as well so they don’t build up threat too easily in comparison to the DPS classes.

          • Vincera

            I’m having trouble catching your point. I get that presently taunts don’t miss, which was my point earlier. I read in the above livestream notes that taunts will have a chance to miss in 3.0, and that tanks have an accuracy bonus coming, so you interpret that to mean the miss chance is ameliorated by the accuracy bonus, yes? As far as PvE goes, I am inclined to agree.

            As for the DPS nerf, of course it would be for all classes in the interests of balance and fairness. I’m speaking specifically to the role of the tank and how it will change as a result of faster cycling via the new alacrity mechanic.

            • EyesOfGehenna .

              yes bosses have an extra defense which requires you to get your melee accuracy to 100% and force/tech accuracy to 110% to not miss with any attacks. The 10% accuracy bonus accomplishes this so tanks will not have a problem.
              Alacrity may not be as useful for tanks. It’s hard to say. In essence it’s about the defensive cooldowns because if you stack alacrity you lose defensive stats. So I am not sure if stacking alacrity will be viable for tanks since you have limited defensive cooldowns and their cooldown time tends to be long I doubt alacrity will be really useful for tanks. My guess is that new content will be attuned to this and that bosses that need to be interrupted will either cast less often or there is a role for dps to interrupt more than before. That remains to be seen.
              But in any case a level cap raise is about getting new gear for new content. Just because they chose to nerf current damage instead of just adding higher numbers doesn’t really change that. That’s just perception.

              • Christopher Luther

                They are claiming that certain enemies in operations may have more than 10% defense, which means that, no, the 10% buff from a tank stance will not be adequate.

                Q: Taunts can now miss on Operation bosses?
                A: Dependent on the operation boss, the system now allow this capacity
                and some bosses can have buffs that have extra defense to force players
                to gear up accuracy.

    • Keks

      well other then reduced CD on your def CDs Alacrity is still useless for Tanks so you just do everything as you do now, and take the Accuracy defense Earpieces&Implant’s you would usually stick to the Companion you aren’t using anyway for fights against bosses with increased defense.

      and about re-earning the endgame stats, there’s no way around that because tanks get way to powerful the closer to 100% mitigation they come.

      • Vincera

        I see your point, but those other (usu. MK-1) implants, earpieces and other gear generally have poorer mitigation bonuses resulting in poorer overall tank performance and higher, unnecessary reliance on other roles.

        As for getting to 100 % mitigation, I think that’s outside the reach of gear you can get for comms or through reverse engineering, which is the ceiling I’m discussing (hence 140 and 180 gear) and falls into the category of diminishing returns – the more Def you have, the less Absorb/Shield you can get, and so on. That’s my PvE experience, anyhow.

        The continued refinement of Alacrity suggests you can cycle through abilities faster, meaning bosses will take advantage of this mechanic to 1) cycle faster themselves and 2) force tanks to do so in order to maintain aggro and cycle our own abilities (CD, maintenance of Rage/Focus, etc.). Combined with slowed CD for interrupts and blunted DPS, this means a new dynamic is forming with lower survivability.

        Truly, I hope I’m wrong.

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          Currently tanks don’t need to stack accuracy and they won’t either in 3.0 because they will get a 10% accuracy bonus for being in tank stance. The defensive stats will be about the same I suppose but it will be interesting to see if alacrity becomes useful for tanks because it will lower the cd on interrupts and on defensive cooldowns. Theorycrafters will have fun with that one I’m sure 😉

          • Guardthebloodydps

            Well, one of the problems with guardians is our TPS, alacrity in theory would increase that. Which would explain why they are so fond of throwing it on comm gear, and would indicate that one of it’s intended purposes of it for Defence Guardians is to increase TPS

            • Iron-Clad

              There is no hidden meaning behind alacrity on tank gear. The devs have said it before: they intentionally create poorly itemized gear because they want to force people to take advantage of the mod/enh system. They want people to optimize their gear themselves, not just receive perfectly optimized gear from vendors.

            • EyesOfGehenna .

              nah I am with iron clad on this. They do poor itemization on purpose. I fully expect them to put crit on tank gear in 3.0

        • Keks

          it’s not about getting 100% less damage

          if you reduce all incoming damage by 60% increasing it by another one%
          reduces incoming damage from 40% to 39% that’s 2,5% less damage taken. if you have 80% DR and gain another one% -> 20% damage taken to 19% damage taken that’s 5% less damage taken.
          which means:
          gaining one% DR at 80% DR is 100% more worth then gaining one% at 60% DR so diminishing returns are well and nice but you need to be aware that they don’t work the same way for tanks as they do for DPS&Heals

          you can Ignore Alacrity on anything relating to tanks except if it allows you to use a Def CD you previously used on a spike you couldn’t reduce / avoid otherwise. (just ignore it completly we are talking about ~3sec from an one minute CD if you waste half your current (2.0 numbers) Shield budget on alacrity)

          taunts must never miss that’s the important thing when it comes to tank DPS in PVE,
          (well all three tanks having roughly equal numbers is also Important but only if your DPS aren’t capable of doing their Job on their own.)

          about that:
          “The continued refinement of Alacrity suggests you can cycle through abilities faster, meaning bosses will take advantage of this mechanic too”

          all the bosses have different hit/sec anyway, nothing to worry there.

  • IncuBB .

    1. Taunts don’t miss in pre 3.0
    2. Devs make taunts miss in 3.0
    3. Devs add accuracy buff for tanks in 3.0 to prevent taunts miss…
    Hmmm…
    Ummmm…
    Ughhh…
    Dammit, i can’t follow logic that DON’T HAVE ANY COMMON SENCE!!!
    What the hell is wrong with those people??!!

    Just simple example of this logic:
    1. Onion rings is popular and tasty.
    2. Manufacture decides to cancel onion rings becouse “people needs something new”.
    3. Manufacture start to produce onion… squares. Same colour. Same taste.

    Whats the point? Seriosly, i don’t see a point in this.

    • Vincera

      I think the point is to tweak PvP taunts, but in order to do so they must tweak the whole taunt system. They still want taunts to be essentially unavoidable for PvE, to preserve the boss mechanic, but they must therefore apply a “back-end” fix to get the new taunt mechanism to work both ways.

      Or, using your analogy, they used to make onion rings in a one-step process that left some sticking together and that really annoyed people. Now, they make them in a two-step process that prevents that occasional massive onion ring chunk.

      • Christopher Luther

        Nope. They want certain enemies to be able to resist taunting and force tanks to gear accuracy.

        “Q: Taunts can now miss on Operation bosses?

        A: Dependent on the operation boss, the system now allow this capacity and
        some bosses can have buffs that have extra defense to force players to
        gear up accuracy. “

      • Mr Popo’s Troll

        So to get around the taunt-miss just buff accuracy then problem solved, AOE taunt in pvp will still not miss then what will the devs do? Probably limit how much accuracy you can stack by adding in diminishing returns……. Yep sounds like typical Dev thinking to me

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      Taunts did miss before 2.0 actually. But it’s ok, there seem to be a lot of things you don’t understand. I’ll give you a hint…it has to do with pvp and how dps use taunts and not with actual tanks.

      • IncuBB .

        Umm… WROOOONG.
        Dps stack accuracy no matter what. Its the primary stat, so basically its pointless change.

        1.Tanks recieve a buff to accuracy to prevent taunts miss.
        2. DPS stack accuracy to prevent ALL attacks and utility miss.

        And here comes the question – whats the point again?

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          The point is that you don’t know what everybody stacks and how. BW has metrics so they do know what most people do. So I reject your opinion about what people do in pvp. So if you want to get upset because of your own assumptions, have fun with that. If you want to believe that they are doing this just for the heck of it without any reasons to back this up, have fun with that. But I am pretty sure there are lots of things that people do especially in pvp that borders on exploits because it is much more competitive. If you just want to ignore these realities in favour of your “feelings”…again, good luck with that.

          • IncuBB .

            Yeah… We, russians, usually call your reaction – “Вы все пидорасы, а я Д,Артаньян”
            Feel free to find translation.

            • EyesOfGehenna .

              No thanks. I am not going to put effort into being insulted. Feel free to quit the game over this though. I am sure we’ll get over it.

            • Ken Gorman

              wtf is I D Artagnan?

      • DarkSlayerrrrrr

        Honestly that is a silly reason to change taunt machanics because of pvp DPS using AOE taunts like mass-mind control to protect their team. Isn’t that the purpose of the ability? What about ballistic shield that snipers use to buff defense of everyone under the bubble? Are devs going to allow that to miss now too? Honestly the whole thing is stupid. Why not just leave the machanics alone? Because someone somewhere cried OP! OP! OP! Then the Devs are like where? Where? Where? Then like OH NO OH CRAP we’ve GOT to fix this…..

  • Sadriel_Fett

    So, they’re raising the level cap, but lowering the DPS so it’s going to be basically the same as it is now when you max your level? Why bother raising the level cap, then?

    • Estranged

      Players like levels.

      It is a mini stat squish. If all of the content is adjusted accordingly, it just doesn’t matter.

      • Angelo

        It does matter, why would you increase the level cap just to do the same dps as a current level 55. This screams utter idiozy from a development point of view, do they purposely want to break the game?

        • Estranged

          I think the epeen statements throughout this comment section hit the spot. Don’t even run a parser, I really don’t care. Didn’t get into this game to turn it into another WoW DPs epeen sausage fest.

  • matt

    Am I the only one here who feels that the DPS nerf is not going to matter, the content is still going to be balanced against endgame geared players anyway, what difference does what the numbers read make?

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      No, that’s exactly what I am thinking too.

      • Przemysław Narbutt

        Not only you, but some people need to grow bigger epenis 🙂

    • Agendha

      I agree man. Gamers need stuff to complain about, and if there is nothing to complain about, they will make stuff up.

  • Angelo

    So Bioware, you got a server ready with the old build just in case your changes break the entire game? I would happily pay double monthly fee’s for you not to go live with this crap.

    • Keks

      and miss out on the awesome Buff/Debuff tracking they implemented?
      there aren’t nearly enough Cons in the Update to outweigh that one huge pro.

  • Rickster

    Why nerf lvl 55 stats and have lvl 60 stats do same DPS? For those of
    you still around from Rise of the Hutt Cartel go live. They did not do
    this to lvl 50 stats when they introduced the lvl 55 cap. So I am very
    confused??? Already purchased this expansion, but after I get through
    the new content. I think I will no longer be a Sub. Shame really been a
    sub since Live 12/13/2011.

    • userleftyourchannel

      I would not object against lower player DPS if the mobs also got proportionally lower DPS throughout the game. The other problem is that some (even if few) normal mobs can do thing that players cannot – stun, interrupt, knockback. These abilities should only be limited to strong, elite, champion level of mobs (proportionally to the mob level). Currently it is the most annoying for the leveling experience that normal mobs (droids) can break your tactic against them, and deal a lot of damage. Their hitpoints were never a problem while leveling (outside heroic areas).

      But what devs do? They lower hp of mobs, to make leveling easier. I’m asking, who did they ask for any advice on what is needed to make leveling more fun and enjoyable? Surely, it was not the players they asked. Maybe the reason is the lowered dps from players… And again, why just not raise the level req. of OPS/HM/NiM content to make them adequately harder for 60 lvls??? Is it really better to break the whole system, than to adjust HM/NiM FP/OPS content??? WHo would understand the point of it?

      • Keks

        simplest reason: PVP

        People die to fast because of the DPS inflation that happened because the devs overdid it (even more then usual) when they buffed DPS

        with the Higher HP Pools we’ll have with lv60 current dps are probably just about right but with 55 it is to high, to much burst.

        that’s my guess anyway.

        • userleftyourchannel

          If the huge pvp DPS is the reason (which I can agree, its big) why don’t they come out and say it aloud? I agree that pure dps groups have the highest chance of winning, which can be a good reason to tone it down.

          But related to the taunt-accuracy problem, I think the best nerf would be to lower the damage reduction from taunts in pvp, from 30% down to 20 or less, and do not tinker with the accuracy.

          Imho the worst thing in pvp is the group finder – one group gets 3 healers, another gets 1 or none. Etc. you see my point. GF should make sure that the 2 opposing groups are matched as closely as possible in their roles, pvp/pve gear distribution, gaming experience (measured by valor), so that each group really has some chance to win. If it means that premade groups are out of unranked wz, so be it. They can always do ranked pvp if they want to power own warzones. Unranked solo queues are the only way to somehow give a casual gamer the chance to learn pvp without being squished most of the time.

          Here comes another issue: we need more active players to provide faster/viable group finder results and better experience for all. So we need the game to be really attractive for all people. Let this be a challenge for BW.

          • Keks

            PVP makes the Problem visible but it’s not a PVP Problem the DPS Inflation is at least as much the fault of PVE as it is of PVP

            about the rest I agree the Team balance is just plain bad and to all the people who say there aren’t enough people in the queue to create even teams

            maybe these uneven teams are the reason why there are so few people in the queue.

            then again the last 6 months I didn’t even log into the game unless someone invited me to an ops via Teamespeak, so I’m absolutely no authority on PVP.
            But whenever i did pvp it was pretty simple:

            First BG is a win? Roflestomp for the rest of the day.

            first BG is a loss? Roflestomp for the rest of the day, only that my team is the one being trampled,

            there was the odd game that was really close it’s these games where it doesn’t really matter if you win or loose but they are way to rare to waste time hoping for one.

            however i believe we drifted pretty far offtopic.

    • Estranged

      Why does it matter?

  • Lumi

    How about everybody learns the difference between ***content patches*** that are called “Digital Expansion”s and ACTUAL expansions like “Rise of the Hutt Cartel” and “Shadow of Revan” that are also called “Digital Expansion”s?

    Is everyone’s epeen really so low you need higher numbers on your screen to feel special? Everything below your level will still die faster than it currently does.

    Even if they didn’t reduce the outgoing damage and made you hit harder, they would just boost everyone’s endurance in PvP and the health on mobs/bosses in PVE. Everything would be adjusted and your time to kill something your level would stay the same no matter if they reduced the stats or increased them

  • userleftyourchannel

    I want 3.0 to provide us with the access to gear/drops of the entire range of enhancements/mods. Obviously, I’m talking about some nice Immunity and similar enhancements, that were not possible to obtain previously, but should exist basing on the system of rules for gear. Given the extra sheilding and absorb from this gear, tanks could easily find some pieces containing accuracy quite viable in their gear setup, thus making all the effort to break current taunting system needless.
    How about devs started to think what ppl want, not what they want the people to want???

  • Terrorus

    Any word on the classes livestreams? As in which order are they going to be presented?

    • Keks

      http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=773845

      Hey folks,

      As many of you know, we will be streaming around each individual Advanced Class and the changes coming to their Disciplines in 3.0. We will be starting those streams this week and do one set of base Class mirrors each week for the three weeks thereafter. Here is our currently planned schedule. As always this could change, but here is our plan as of right now!

      Friday, November 7th – Bounty Hunter and Trooper

      Thursday, November 13th – Inquisitor and Consular

      Friday, November 21st – Warrior and Knight

      Wednesday, November 26th – Agent and Smuggler

      Thanks everyone! We’ll see you on stream to talk about all of the changes coming to in 3.0.

      -eric

      • EyesOfGehenna .

        Interesting. Apparently they made some changes cause why else do the inquisitor/consular again….

        • Mazio

          Well, because they didn’t show anything from Shadows/Assassins which are part of the inquisitor/consular family. They will most likely just quickly go over the sorc again and any changes they may have made and show us the Sage animations, but the main focus will probably be on Shadow/Sin side of things

        • Keks

          Shadows are People too! :p (Assassins as well (but less so :p:p))

  • ItsRainingSith

    I feel like the majority of changes they are going to implement were planned with only the PvP in mind, even though they are going to affect PvE too… I don’t like this at all. But still, nevermind, I’ll try to adapt as always…

    • Lumi

      Forgive the repost, but it is clear my OP was too far down for most people to bother reading it:

      “Welcome to MMO’s…

      PvP ALWAYS dictates major combat changes, no matter what the game is, no matter who the developer is. There are plenty of “player vs player” games out there, basically any game where two or more players play against each other, and a lot of single player games (player vs everything.)

      Those kinds of games require very little in terms of balancing because they only have to focus on that one aspect, but the same cannot be said for MMO’s which offer both. Therefor they must be balanced for both and usually takes some creative thinking on the developers parts. NO MMO IN HISTORY has been able to make PVE changes that don’t impact PVP and vice versa.

      PvP players are notorious for thinking outside the box, whereas most PVE content have certain ways of doing things and the outcome is always fixed. The sheer complexities of 8 classes and their myriad of talents, skills, and varying skill levels ensures that PvP will forever decide what future changes will be required.

      Sorry, boss – Get used to it”

      • EyesOfGehenna .

        I generally agree with you but for example in GW1 they had some good ideas. What they did is have pve only skills that simply didn’t work in pvp and also they had skills that had a pvp and pve version. Meaning that it has the normal effects except in pvp areas. BW already did something that hints at that by making healing less powerful in pvp than in pve. What I just don’t get is why MMOs insist on using the exact same skill set for pve and pvp. You will never get that balanced right because they are completely different types of gameplay. And you are right that because of that pvp generally triggers the need for skill changes. I think for SWTOR the best solution is what Anet did in GW1 with different versions of skills. Of course GW1 also allowed you to save skill bars so you could reload them into your UI in less than a second.

        • Lumi

          Rift tried to do something very similar in having a single PVP tree and having both PvE and PvP versions of abilities that worked respectively. It only resulted in too much complexity for the average player, leaving most overwhelmed at the choices and consequences on both sides of the coin. The idea the developers these days are overwhelmingly agreeing on is “Keep It Simple, Stupid”

          • Lumi

            Just to add to that thought, a few meaningful choices is a lot more satisfying than a bunch of meaningless choices.

  • HadesClutch

    Of course Alacrity was bad, you guys made it like that! Get you some common sense Bioware, for crying out loud.

  • Darth Agonal

    Anyone else think its b.s. that our 55’s are getting nerfed just so that BW can provide a lazy way for us to “progress?” All anyone is doing is just building back up to where we started. WTF!?! Basically we’re buying the “privilege” of grinding out 5 more levels just to break even with where we started pre-3.0 for $20.00. What a crock of sh*t! So anyone who chose not to buy the expansion took a flat out reduction in power from the day before the update that they cannot overcome. Should have just left the cap alone instead of this drek. Fail.

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      No I think it’s BS that people think just upping numbers is important. Understand that if they just up the numbers, they are essentially offering the same content as they are doing now. Remember that when we got Makeb they lowered our stats as well going from level 50-55. MMOs are about getting more levels and mastering new content and gearing up. That’s endgame at least. If you care so much about the actual numbers then I find that a bit sad really. Realistically it doesn’t make a real difference for the content. What it probably does is make it easier for them to implement the new level cap which means less time investment and fewer chances for screw ups. I am ok with that.

      • Darth Agonal

        Which brings us to the real issue: why bother raising the level cap if you have to do it by diminishing existing power levels just to add 5 more numbers onto a player’s level? Pointless exercise. Unless we want to presume the worst – which is that it’s a deliberate cash grab. Essentially they skimmed 5 levels off of all of us and put it behind a pay wall. $20.00 gets you your pre-existing character back, basically. Taking something from someone and then trying to sell it back to them is called extortion in any other setting. So does that make this the new digital “extortion” pack? Or just another boneheaded idea by EAware?

        • EyesOfGehenna .

          For me there doesn’t have to be a level cap raise. I played GW1 for many years and it never had a level cap raise but got new continents, classes and storylines. In fact about 80% or more of the entire game is endgame. Why I think they do it here is because this is a more traditional MMO and you can only deviate from so many standard conventions at a time. People see a level cap raise as a big deal and a marker of new content. It’s the sense of progression. So yeh, in essence I do understand why especially DPS players get upset about this but if you think about it, it’s all just an illusion. So I guess you could wonder how many illusions do you want to break in one update? There will be new story lines, new operations, new gear sets to get etc. That’s the actual content. If you think that higher numbers are the actual content then I understand why you would call it an extortion pack but to me that’s a strange way to look at it. It’s all made up numbers. By your definition any computer game is extortion. Don’t forget it’s imaginary. You truly won’t impress girls more with having a DPS that can hit 5k instead of 4k dps. New content is what there is to do. As soon as the reset is done, it’s business as usual.

        • Terrorus

          Only the DPS numbers will be lowered, not overall power levels. That is a way to keep the current top Operation content challenging and enjoyable after the cap raise. Also, it helps developers have better control over challange level when creating new content.
          Besides, since they are reworking the whole of the skill system and a lot of the secondary stats, major changes were to be expected.
          On a side note, if large number are your thing, maybe you should try EVE Online? Great game.

    • Shawn Hargrave

      why i didnt pre order or buy it in general till i have all the facts about the xpac. Now the next month theyll drag out the discpline thing possibly the next nge (please note this an opinion nothing more)

      • Darth Agonal

        You missed the entire point I was trying to make. This is also nothing like the NGE you obviously never played SWG if that’s your “opinion”.

        Of course that’s your opinion what else would it be? Were you suggesting it could be fact?
        Oh and Opinions can be wrong. Just like your opinion is wrong right now.

        • Shawn Hargrave

          opinions are neither wrong or right thier views lol. I played swg from launch to just 6 months before shutdown.

          • Darth Agonal

            that’s completely not true at all. Opinions can be wrong You could have the opinion that vaccines cause autism. That would be wrong. When your opinion contradicts facts its wrong. Your opinion that this is like the NGE is wrong because it contradicts facts such as what the NGE is. There is no way you even played any bit of SWG.

            • Shawn Hargrave

              We dont know either way until the launch of revan really. Yeah i played swg its why i said what i did.

              • Darth Agonal

                We know right now that its nothing like NGE. We have seen the live stream they haven’t done anything like the NGE.

                Right now your opinion is wrong. You can explain what about this is like the NGE. But they already showed us what is instore

              • Shawn Hargrave

                Uh no they havent because this month is showing the discpline system lol.Im talking about 3.0 what we know which is 20% at most at this point.

              • Darth Aganol

                The other displaces are going to be the same thing
                what do you think happened in the NGE?

  • Darth Polluxx

    Was told that DPS Juggs will be “downgraded” with the new system/mechanics, if it’s true, it’s the end of this game for me …

    • EyesOfGehenna .

      All DPS will downgraded for every class including tanks and healers. So you DPS jugg will still be relevant. In fact, this downgrade makes DPS even more important.

      • Darth Polluxx

        That wasn’t what I mean, but ok …
        Don’t agree with this either …

    • Vengeful

      Wow,look,poor already Op jugger player cry for being nerfed… go learn play real class not noobs favored op like jug.

  • Ken Gorman

    Nerfing everyone so that their op bosses don’t get hurt, typical of these damn cry baby Devs. Boo-Hoo people are hurting the boss bad I designed better nerf the players or buff my boss. they should of just followed EQ’s lead and just locked out 60’s from raping low level bosses problem solved without ruining our dps epeen. Also hate it when PvE gets bashed over the head because PvP cry babies whining about one thing or another. like it wasn’t lame enough when they nerfed Spike sheesh

  • Brianac

    So what will HP, and healing numbers look like? Anyone know or think they know??

  • Christopher Luther

    Keep interrupts at the same cooldown.

    When interrupting another player, add a debuff that prevents you from using an interrupt on another player target for 18s.

    But then that would be logical, wouldn’t it?

  • Christopher Luther

    I’m confused by people talking about the improvements to alacrity. No where do I see that it will reduce *ability* cooldowns—only the global cooldown (which it does already) and internal cooldowns, such as the proc of an assassin/shadow’s lightsaber charge/technique or Ion Gas Cylinder/Cell. Am I missing something or are they?

  • KShrike

    Everyone’s getting mad at the DPS decrease when it’s obvious that Bioware is pre-emptively trying to prevent the stat inflation problem that WoW has.

  • Bradford Bernard

    ok basically your paying 20 bux for a DLC and for 20 bux its an extremely good DLC so honestly stop crying foul play and enjoy the damn DLC cause it really is a good one, I compare it to skyrims Dragonborn, I am having a lot of fun with it, if you would put down your bias and stop worrying about min/maxing you might find that you can enjoy the DLC as well.

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