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SWTOR Bioware taking action against Ziost Exploiters

Since the launch of patch 3.2 yesterday, some players have been accessing the Ziost operation boss via an exploit to gain 204 mainhands. Bioware will be taking action against those players.

So Bioware, about people bypassing the locked part on Ziost to fight the OP Boss etc. | 04.29.2015, 03:15 PM

One of the things we tried to be clear about with the Ravagers is that we are serious about handling exploits. With that exploit, the Ravagers we were open about our process and the action we were taking. For this issue with Ziost, we are going to do the same.

If a player is bypassing the environment to access an area they should not be able to, and then killing a boss to get loot they should also not have access to, we absolutely consider this an exploit. We are investigating this issue right now, and will be actioning any player who participates, or has participated, in this exploit.

If you ever hear of or find something that can be exploited, do not test it yourself. Please notify us immediately and privately. Some of you brought this issue to our attention on PTS and we thank you for that. We closed that opening, but it seems that there is another method of getting into the area.

We would also like to thank those of you who did not exploit and who have brought this to our attention. Our goal will always be to create a safe and fair environment for our players.
Thanks.

-eric

So Bioware, about people bypassing the locked part on Ziost to fight the OP Boss etc. | 04.29.2015, 08:09 PM

Hey folks,
As I mentioned earlier this morning, we very quickly isolated what the exploit entailed and began an investigation into players who have participated. As of now, we have identified those unique accounts which have gone into the blocked off area of Ziost, and killed one of the two bosses present. For each of these players, they will receive a minimum of the following action:

  • Multiple day suspension
  • Removal of all gear earned through defeating those bosses
  • Removal of all achievements earned through defeating those bosses
  • Reduction in Elite and Ultimate Commendations

We will continue to monitor the blocked off area of Ziost throughout Monday, May the 4th, which is when it opens officially. Any player who is found to participate in this exploit beyond todayโ€™s notice will likely receive more aggressive action. Thank you all for bringing this to our attention.
-eric

So Bioware, about people bypassing the locked part on Ziost to fight the OP Boss etc. | 04.30.2015, 06:45 PM

Hey folks,

I wanted to give you an update on the Ziost exploit that was discovered. As mentioned in my post yesterday, we took action against those players who had participated and we are continuing to monitor for additional players throughout May 4th. In doing so, we have discovered more players who were exploiting last night. Since we had previously expressed that participation was considered an exploit, we are going to be increasing the action taken against these players. Those players will all be receiving a minimum of a one week suspension, along with the other actions which we listed yesterday.

To reiterate, we will continue to monitor this issue throughout the morning of May 4th when the area goes live. Action will continue against players who participate in this exploit. Thank you all for helping us to keep The Old Republic a fun and fair place for everyone.
-eric

By Dulfy

MMO guide writer and blogger. Currently playing and covering SWTOR, GW2, and TSW.

356 replies on “SWTOR Bioware taking action against Ziost Exploiters”

Because I belive people who not cheating have enough of exploitnig and send massive ticket or posts forum. Anyway this is good news

kudos on bioware for addressing this very quickly and hopefully all who did this exploit gets punished all of them

saw a guy linking the 204 mainhand he got in chat now i know its an exploit fuck that bastard

Your sarcasm is palpable. Weren’t you unsubbed? You don’t pay for it, so what do you care? You get what you pay for.

You misunderstand me, I actually truly am applauding them.
And I *did* pay for it. All $180 of sub that I did pay. I said I was taking a hiatus, waiting until it’s worth it to come back.
The only real reason I’m not back yet is because a combination of exams and me being a part of another MMO. And me being hurt for about $60 of that being a waste these past four months.
These actions Bioware are taking right now are a stark contrast to the complacency that they’ve exhibited these past four months.
So I’m applauding them.

Yeah, maybe they will ban the offenders for two whole days this time. /s

“If you ever hear of or find something that can be exploited, do not test
it yourself. Please notify us immediately and privately.” – Unless, of course, you are a f2p or a pref, because in those cases we do not allow you to open support tickets or to file /bug reports and the support@swtor.com e-mail is handled by an auto-replier..

Except for the whole, you know, fixing exploits before they go live thing. Because, this exploit was known on the PTS. But, yes, at least they are responding quickly to it.

The exploit on the PTS was fixed. Some people who knew what to look for found another place to break through. RTFA.

“One of the things we tried to be clear about with the Ravagers is that
we are serious about handling exploits. […] For this
issue with Ziost, we are going to do the same.”

If that so, then rush people until it’s still available!…

Nice one . Hope BW lets the dark side aligned people do the punishment for all who took advantage of the Exploit ๐Ÿ™‚

One of the people posting that they got the 204 Mainhand was from Zorz. I bet nothing happens to Bioware’s favorite children…lol.

None of them were from Zorz. Zorz don’t go there, they just sell stuff they exploited ๐Ÿ˜‰

As someone who knows a lot of QA testers, never blame the test groups. They almost always find stuff, its the production teams that often let things slip.

The only reason they addressed it early is bc the area is going to be available on Monday. Meanwhile, those who win traded in pvp last season are riding around on their pirate ship with their brand new crystals.

Agreed. I thought about it and I shouldve said “meanwhile, win traders are STILL riding around on their season 1 rancor”

I don’t think win trading was really prevalent till s2 or s3. But sure, I do love my little s1 rancor.

Just fix your shit bioware. Its pathetic how bad the geometry is in this game. Fucking need to use /stuck EVERYWHERE !

Hahahaha! Action—>consequences! I hope they fry the repeat offenders. There’s always a group of spoiled children that think they can just do whatever they want whether it’s acceptable or not. I’ll bet well over half of these are the same ones from the ravagers exploit, and I hope every one of them gets banned.

d’oh I cant believe ive been playing since beta and never knew that the starship flies by when you use that skill

They saw how many of the paying customers went for it last time. They know they can’t really ban em so have to at least look stern.

This is the part where we laugh when Bioware takes away the mainhand they won and doesn’t bother restoring the one they replaced, right? ๐Ÿ˜›

So what if they don’t restore it? Their fault for entering a locked area. Perfect punishment, banned and lose your gear. Assuming of course, Bioware does something. But with a picture up now, even they can’t screw this up.

They would ban the paying players but for some reason they cant find time to deal with these credit sellers in-game or make improvements instead we get nerfs because the 1% people cry they lost in pvp and cant play a class to save there butt.

They ban the credit sellers, but the credit sellers just make another randomly generated character on a free account and continue on. Their options are kinda limited without adding frustrating restrictions to the free players they’re trying to entice into the game.

My advice, just put them on ignore and don’t bother reporting them. Getting them banned just means you have to put another name on ignore sooner.

What’s totally bullshit you say?!
We all well known what credit sellers don’t use free accs because f2p just cannot post in general chat until lvl 10, and after they anyway restricted to post 1 post per minute.
Credit sellers use ONLY subbed accs and rotate chars within this accs.
And, of course, BW/EA do NOTHING like bans with SUBBED accs. They pay – and they spam gold sell again and again and again… 8)

*yawns* really getting tired of Bioware calling everyone “exploiters” for playing the game they made… if you would fix your stuff, this wouldn’t happen. How can you honestly blame players for trying to sneak into secret areas when this is an MMO that actually has secret areas and missions that can only be activated when you meet certain conditions…. it’s not like people are running scripts or changing game files to hack items, we are simply playing the game you made. It’s just mind blowing that Bioware is blaming its users for an issue they created and didn’t fix. That’s kinda like if you got brakes done on your car and they completely messed up installing them and then you slam on your brakes and they don’t work, you crash. Well now that shop says it’s your fault because brakes aren’t meant to be hit that hard and you didn’t follow certain guidelines, regardless of the fact that they didn’t install them properly. I really want a job like these Bioware employees have…they can half ass a bug fix then sit back and blame their customers! if I tried to blame my clients for my mistakes, I would be out of a job real quick.

Valid point about how the game encourages players to access hidden and difficult-to-reach areas. I saw a similar post on the official forums that was deleted within minutes. Apparently BW doesn’t like anyone that isn’t towing the exploit line.

OMG, I just realized you’re absolutely right! The whole point of hunting for datacrons, especially Makeb, is to train us to be good at accessing areas that are not genearally easily accessed. And now they call us exploiters for doing what THEY trained us to do best – Jumping on rocks and collaborating with each other!

Indeed, Bioware have made a hobby of training players to reach things that appear unobtainable. If they abused a boss mechanic or glitch like in Ravagers or Nefra, then that would justify some action being taken. This… It’s just poor level design and lack of forward planning on Bioware’s behalf. I still remember running over the shield on EC to bypass the mobs, but they didn’t penalise anyone for their cockups in level design back then. It’s a bit rich that they should start now…

There WAS that time I stumbled and fell into the Makeb endurance datacron by accident.

Then there was that other time I heard about all the punishments they dished out for all the exploiters with the Monsters of Makeb achievement after they killed the rancor illegally in the zoned off area. Everyone was up in arms calling for those people to get banned!

Oh wait…neither of those things actually happened. I must just be delusional.

So your thinking is like there are cookies in the jar but mom said you can’t eat them right now. Instead of doing as you’re told you eat them anyway. When asked why you ate the cookies your defense is ” If you didn’t want me to eat them why did you put them there?”

Grow up and be an adult. Quit crying because you got caught exploiting again.

You mean its okey to steal your car when you are so stupid to let the keys in the ignition? Right? Same analogy here. So you wouldn’t call the police on me? Since it was you to blame for not paying enough care. Right?
Or is it now not so nice anymore?

Pathetic ……..

Actually a more apt comparison would be buying a product that is advertised and listed with a decimal point in the wrong place by accident. Their cockup, but you can bet your ass they will try to enforce the real price at the register. Sadly there is no “code of practice” for game developers…

Anyone who demands to pay that wrong price is a scumbag. If the 55 inch tv has a price of $120.000 instead of $1200.00 you know what the price is you are just trash. If you walked a TV up to the register and the tag said $12000.0 you would demand that the price be changed.

Welcome to business in Australia, where we actually expect companies to exercise their responsibility to check prices before they post them for the public. That example I posted is actually enshrined in the Australian Consumer Law. Basically it means whenever any company, regardless of nationality, deals with Australian consumers, those companies are bound by law to stand by the quality of their products and services, and the prices being advertised for such. The fun part is that law supercedes the ToS and EULA, so it is enforcable, too.

That’s bull, it’s part of the agreement you agree to before playing this game. If you run into an exploit, which can always happen, then you need to report it to them and not abuse it. That’s the agreement. If you don’t keep your side of the agreement, they can punish you for not sticking to the agreement. It’s simple really.

What exploit? If I find a part of the game word that is open to me, why should I not explore it and take on whatever I find in there? As I said in a different comment, it’s not like they’re exploiting a glitch in the mechanics of a boss or a glitch with the operation itself. That I would support being actioned asap (provided they didn’t leave it forever once it was reported after doing a half-arsed fix and then reversing said fix, as they did with Rav). I see no post in-game or outside of the game stating that area was off-limits prior to their actioning the “exploit”, so them labeling it as such is highly questionable, and frankly it comes across as their trying to cover for the crappy environment design and the shocking lack of quality control they have repeatedly displayed.

Its hardly crappy quality control. They had to bug their way in. It wasn’t just a few Mario jumps.
Plenty of mmo’s have these issues, their exploiters are punished too. Normally the second it goes from exploring, to exploiting. There is a pretty clear line. I jump all over the place in new areas to see what I can do or find. I get stuck a lot, I get to all kinds of weird places. When I find myself somewhere I am definitely not supposed to be though, I leave it at that, I don’t try to see what I can get out of it.

You are just a douchebag. The more you try to justify yourself, the more of a douchebag you prove yourself to be. Please continue.

Really wish jackasses would stop using the actual secret areas as an excuse for the cheating they do. End result will be the elimination of secrets. Pretending you cant tell the difference is pretty sad too. Are you a smart person who thinks bioware should believe you are really that stupid? Or are you really that stupid?

He has already been punished. I heard second hand that it is a 3 day ban. Seems a bit weak to me, but at least Bioware have done something. Not sure why he would post the video so soon after he was disciplined. *That* seems even dumber than the exploit in the first place.

It is a 3 day ban and removel of gear etc. This seems weak but it’s also a first offence ban. I know Thiil in game and he’s alright but I’m thinking that the accounts of people banned won’t get a small ban next time around as they probably keep lists of offenders.

Yeah that was the point of the slap on the wrist they gave out over the Ravagers exploit. They knew they let it go to long hence the small punishment. Now every time those people on the list do it again it’s going to get worse. If people didn’t learn from Ravagers it’s their own fault.

Exploiting sucks, its just wasted time and resources. Its so funny every time they try to enrich an aspect of the game everyone is like “OMG you did this instead of fixing bugs?!
But then we have assholes backdooring their way into obviously walled off content, and forcing people to go through and remove their ill gotten gains, hand out bans, etc etc, which is honestly, and whole heartedly, time that could have actually been spent doing something better.
And then to follow it up with the “Totally worth it” and the “H8 us cause they aint us!” trash? Selfish. Nobody really cares that someone killed a boss that was erased. Its really no different then a PTS kill, only it peels time away from fixing bugs and puts it into repairing shit selfish idiots broke.
Shameless and low.

Exploiting sucks, but I think it sucks mostly for the people that do it. It sounds like this person had a lot of fun killing the boss. Musco made a mistake labeling this an exploit. They should have either ignored this instance or made light of it. This just isn’t comparable to game-damaging exploits like Ravagers.

The more exceptions you make, the less seriously people will take the rules. An exploit is an exploit. If it’s a smaller one then 3 day bans are enough, but people knowingly break the rules and that’s the point. If you don’t stop it here people will complain saying “but with ziost you didn’t punish anyone so this is bull”. They have to make a stand on this or exploiting will become common place and that would just cheapen the game entirely.

I agree. Once they label it an exploit they must carry out the promised punishment. The problem was that it shouldn’t have been labeled an exploit by BW.

It was an exploit. People were able to go into an area in a way they were not intended to, before they were intended to. THAT IS AN EXPLOIT and it should be labeled as such.

I’m just unclear when something is intuitively an exploit and when it’s not. There’s a spot on Makeb that has a rancor behind a barrier that you need to kill if you want the achievement. Clearly it was designed to have some method of accessing that doesn’t exist to lower the barrier. Instead you have to cheat your way into it using a couple of different tricks. That was added into the game LONG time ago and still exists today in that same state. Exploit?

It drops hilts and materials right? That’s what made Ravagers game-damaging. People exploiting access to resources they normally wouldn’t with the possibility of great personal gain.

Thats not even the point though, the point is they whine and cry about time wasted on the things they don’t like, but feel (and I am loath to use the word..) entitled enough to waste developer time fixing the effects of their own exploiting. That is honestly the only “wasted” man hours. I dont care if its new pvp content, new rp content, new pve, or even a new commercial, thats all beneficial to my experience. Someone going through log files finding hilts and achievements some children went off and “earned” doesn’t add to the game, it just fixes the things that anyone with half a brain should have understood was off limits.

No to Expoiters.

Ravagers was completely different because it affected the game economy and it was mats and gear that many of the people that exploited would have never gotten otherwise. There was no limit to how many times you could exploit it.
Here we have a boss with a weekly lockout. You can do it once per character and roll for the mainhand and mats along with everyone else in the group. Most importantly, it will be the same content available to everyone next week. These people accessed it a few days early. It’s nothing like the Ravagers exploit.
The only reasons I can think of that people are so upset is that firstly BW officially called it an exploit. This created a tunnel vision with people – EXPLOITING IS EXPLOITING! STONE THEM! When in reality they could have just brushed it off, or you know, actually appropriately blocked the area off if they really didn’t want people accessing it a week early, for whatever silly reason.
The second reason is that someone got something you don’t have and you’re jealous. And no, I’m not one of those people that went into the unauthorized area. I really don’t care that people did because I know they just got to it a few days before me and hopefully can provide some tips on the fight. Good for them.

Hey mate. We got a 72 hours ban and everything removed. Achievs, gear, mats, decor etc. That’s fair enough. Mine is a first offense ban yup, but i haven’t heard of anyone recieving MORE than 72 hours. It was worth it though! That feeling when killing a new HM boss where the only other guild in there gave up – that was a fucking blast ! ๐Ÿ˜€ Totally worth it, 10/10 would recommend, dno if i would do it again

hehe, well I think it’s fair for a first time offence as well, but I hope you remember that next time you have such an occasion that it won’t be a first offence anymore then…would be a shame if you got yourself a permaban.

And waiting til Monday would have killed you, right? Should get perma-banned. As far as I’m concerned if you’re willing to do this you’d cheat on anything else and we don’t need people like you fucking stuff up for the rest of us.

That’s how you win, didn’t you know that? If you can’t get it first by cheating you’re not cool and chicks won’t dig you. How can you be a man otherwise?

Just 72 hours, i’ll be back before you know it, and we’re straight to Monolith HM 8m on Monday? ๐Ÿ˜‰ You can bruteforce the mechanic and ignore some of it ๐Ÿ˜€

You do realise how silly you and your guild look, right? Claiming world first on a boss that isn’t officially open to everyone (except if you chose to exploit) is like claiming world first for killing a boss on PTS. I guess some people will really scrape the bottom of the barrel for some kind of achievement *rolleyes*

Thanks, 3 days given for free by BioWare to tend to social life. I don’t mind that at all tbh, it was ALL worth it!

What was worth it? What do you get out of it? They are taking away anything you got. If you need to be banned to make you do stuff IRL then you need to quit playing anyway.

You really don’t have a life at all, if you gain satisfaction by having a youtube video of your guild killing a boss, but not keeping any of the achievements, gear or loot…

If it was so important to you to exploit a video game to show off to your ‘friends’ you’re not fooling any of us into thinking you have a real social life.

Was totally useless and you can socialize a bit now so you can chill it out.
But you probably wont socialize and will stay buried in a room playing something else.

Tea parties with stuffies and a jizz rag does not constitute a “social life”
Comment should read: 3 days off (that you paid for with the sub) for not-free by Bioware to tend my hand and web browser :p

Hundreds of nerds just looking for glitches and bugs to harrass everyone else are more competent than a handful of testers and Devs.

yeah i enjoy my 3 days break then i will go in the 4th kill it again with the Folks and call muppets muppets again ๐Ÿ™‚

My experience is if someone is a cheating shitbag at something as meaningless as a videogame, they’re a lying cheating shitbag in general.

It could be quadruple for all I care, still doesn’t make it a law of any kind. Your life experience is extremely limited when compared to the totality of the human kind and the vast spectrum of human behavior. As is mine. As is anyone’s. What you’re doing is called stereotyping, and it’s just wrong. Not because I say so, but because it has been proven that stereotyping doesn’t tell us anything about the behavior of a single human being.

So you go against stereotyping by making generalisations…well done…you do see the irony in that I hope.

You did say “As is anyone’s”. You may feel safe at this assumption but you are making a general statement about everyone here and thus it is a generalisation.

I really don’t understand what’s the problem of comprehension here. It was obvious that my point is that NOONE can make such an assumption, because the assumption itself is an invalid one.

It’s like I am telling you that I’ve met 100 people in my life who appear to be very shy, and it just so happens that they’re all Americans. Therefore I make the assumption that all Americans are shy. Or even worse, that whoever is shy, must be an American. My mistake would not be that my life experience would be limited, but that I have come up to a ridiculous conclusion, because I haven’t really proven anything based on my life experience. And it would be idiotic to think that there is even a SINGLE person on this world, who has so much life experience, that they can actually claim that all Americans are shy. Therefore, the problem is not with the observation, but with the logical steps.

It was worth it!

And to all you boo’ers – get over yourselves! It’s a freakin’ game. And all you ToS boot lickers should remember that! We like to play, fool around in game and experiment. We are in this game to take a break from RL and just have fun. For us it was challenging and we had a good time doing it.

On a more serious note this is yet another screw up by BioWare. This whole staged release of the new content has been a cluster fuck. No notice, no message, nothing. People on fleets and on planet confused about what to do or whether this was yet another bug or not.

Labelling this as a “exploit” is seriously a middle finger from BW because they don’t man up to their own mistakes. There was no message, no notice, no indication. And vast majority of players don’t read forums or reddit or other channels. They play game to have fun.

And finally I’d like to say – out kill was legitimate. We spent good deal of time (and repair funds) and brain cells in there to figure out what to do. It wasn’t anything like certain past exploit where you just wandered in and clicked on shiny and got your loot.

People hear the community team say “exploit” and suddenly they’re calling for the gallows for “exploiters” instead of questioning BW for labeling this as an exploit.
They could have made it a fun thing and played around with the community. Instead they decided to be all serious and “punish” people because someone at BW screwed up – again. They make something good and screw it up just a little bit and then lash out at the players. And then the players rally behind them calling for people’s heads. Its toxic for the community and its insane.
People need to take responsibility for their actions. BUT that starts with the people making the content. Own up to your mistake, make a fun thing out of it and move on. No one got hurt. No one got some magical special item that everyone else won’t be able to get in a few days. People are being absolutely insane with the vindictiveness and I can only assume it’s because of jealousy. They’re mad someone got the cookie before mom told them the jar was open for business. Really people. They got a cookie 5 days early. GTF over it.

Is easily done with Mara, jugg dps, snipers and sorcs aswell.
The color-AOE-damage ticks are shroudable btw ๐Ÿ™‚

What the heck? They encourage us to explore to find hidden relics that in difficult places that require a lot of off the path, jumping up cliff faces. But they get mad if people explore the maps and stubble upon the world boss? If they don’t want people getting to it, then fix the problem. Don’t punish the players that were doing something you highly encourage, exploring.

You are abusing obvious bugs and mechanics that are not intended to be like you find them.
By that you not only buy yourself some cheap gimmicks ahead of all legit players (most of them being aware of certain glitches and still don’t abusing them) you also make a fool out of yourself.
It’s kinda cool to find bugs and glitches especially if you can get sth out of it. But the game would be better without people who abuses the sh#t out of it, getting ahead of everyone else and often annoying a good amount of people.

Can’t see anything positive on that, sorry. And I’m long enough around MMOs to remember when exploiters just got banned permanently without further questioning.

The whole thing is just bad business. It’s like, you see ten 12 pack of cokes at the grocery store marked for $1. Now you know that isn’t right and is way too cheap for cokes but you pick it up anyways. You get to the cashier and of course they’ll ring up their actual price of $4.99. You question the price and they will go check to see if what you say is true. At this point they don’t ban you from the damn store. They let you have the cokes at the price of $1 then go and fix their mistake before someone else does the same thing. Now did the customer take advantage of the stores mistake? Yes, yes they did however it was not illegal and the store does not take it out on the customer, they fix it before others learn of the mistake. They don’t go on the intercom and announce, “Well the Coca Cola’s in the soda ale are going to be marked $1 but are really $4.99 but we are not going to bother and try to change the sign.”

But this is exactly what Bioware does. They knew the mistake was there in PST and did not bother to fix it and punish paying people for taking advantage of it. It’s just bad business.

Stop changing the prices on cokes and buy them at their normal price then.

And the biggest advice is stop drinking cokes cos they destroy your health from the inside out totally.

Abusing bugs and glitches is exploiting per definition and therefore officially forbidden by the EULA you all aggree upon creating your game account. Don’t justify harrassment with some silly not fitting real life analogies. You can’t even blame Devs for having such bugs – there are so much more players who are eagerly looking for stuff like that to abuse than there are Devs or testers who could possibly recognize them before release.

It was reported. They failed to fix it. Last time, they left it unfixed for 6 weeks after releasing the expac knowing full well the bug existed. At some point, the Devs have to start taking some responsibility for their own inaction.

I did read. You can’t argue the fact that they didn’t fix it very well if someone was subsequently able to turn around and do the same thing somewhere else in the walled-off section.

Dude, don’t expect me to take your argument seriously when you start it off with “idiot”.
Douchebag.

Anyone who agrees with big corporations will be bigger idiots than those who do not.
So, you’re the bigger idiot in this scenario. Sawrey!

lol. Wtf! ๐Ÿ˜€
Most hilarious comment I’ve seen so far in this more than averagerly humorous discussion.

If you thought that going through a hole in the map geometry to gain access to a BIS weapon was the equivalent of climbing up a hill to get a +4 endurance datacron, then you are, indeed, a complete idiot.

But of course you don’t actually believe any of that, you’re just desperately pretending to in the hope that the GMs will let you keep your toy.

“Hey folks,

As I mentioned earlier this morning, we very quickly isolated what the
exploit entailed and began an investigation into players who have
participated. As of now, we have identified those unique accounts which
have gone into the blocked off area of Ziost, and killed one of the two
bosses present. For each of these players, they will receive a minimum
of the following action:
Multiple day suspension
Removal of all gear earned through defeating those bosses
Removal of all achievements earned through defeating those bosses
Reduction in Elite and Ultimate Commendations

We will continue to monitor the blocked off area of Ziost throughout
Monday, May the 4th, which is when it opens officially. Any player who
is found to participate in this exploit beyond todayโ€™s notice will
likely receive more aggressive action. Thank you all for bringing this
to our attention.”

-eric

Love the handle.

I just start removing earlier ones off the list. By the time its full, all the early spammers are likely already banned.

they dont make new ones that fast and they rarely reuse old ones. That means if you right click names to ignore them you will not see any for hours, sometimes days

And if you are worried about the ignore list getting full… every once in a while clean it out and remove them. Just open the ignore list and hit the minus button to take them off

If theyve been on the list for more than a few days, they likely are already no longer spamming with that character

I only have to clean my ignore list about once every 2 to 3 months and as long as I ignore the gold spammers when I first log in each day, they arent an issue

That’s when you clean it out you can tell what names are the spammers you know stuff like “asdffg”

This is the one area I really wish they took an active role in dealing with. But then they just make a new F2P account when they get banned, so I’m just not sure what else we can expect them to do to deal with this. If they could track IP they may be able to be more aggressive. I’m sure they would love to just auto-ban (lol) every single gold spammer ever, but clearly that technology is currently out of their reach.

Gold sellers don’t use f2p accounts, genius. because f2p have too many restriction to type in general chat.
All goldsellers use only subbed accs ( and rotate chars within ), therefore, BW/EA never do nothing what restricted they profit. Money from goldsellers same money… and smell well, you know… 8)

Credit spammers and the hackers who use the teleport cheats to take all chests from a map in a few seconds during all the day…

I was in tos earlier and after the first boss one of the healers disconnected…a guildie of his told us he just got a 3 day ban.

you produce broken content and its the gamers fault….sigh…epic fail…go make strongholds…..

don’t be silly…games always have bugs and this stuff can happen…point is that as part of the user agreement you agree not to abuse exploits. There is a reason this is in the user agreement: because these things happen. I haven’t played an MMO without exploits in it.

Games have some bugs. Everything BioWare releases for SWTOR is bugged from head to toe. There isn’t a single feature without bugs. Even the simplest changes cause a ton of bugs.

Don’t say, games have bugs, of course they do – we don’t need you to tell us what we already know – but SWTOR has 10x a regular game has.

The thing is, you are in no position to come up with these numbers and estimates. But even if that was the case, it still doesn’t justify exploiting, especially when it’s so obvious. I myself have exploited content in the past, but I was willing to accept any kind of punishment about it. There is no justification, there is only punishment ๐Ÿ™‚

Yeah what a load of bullshit. It has the normal amount of bugs. If you really wanna have a bug contest I assure you ESO or really any elderscrolls game is absolutely worse. But whatever, people have to bitch, and this is a go to when there’s not much else to bitch about. Unsub troll, or at least stay out of the comment section for a game you apparently hate, seriously, why waste the time?

They have warned people about this sht more than once.
So its not like a surprise that they should be banned at least for a week.

Everything now will be punished!!! We are BioWare and we will punish you for being curious. Please don’t leave the marked way on the map, or you will be punished! Don’t explore the world, just do everythink like we inteded it, but we won’t tell you how that way is exactly.

I wish they would punish their dev team for make it so easy exploitable.

BioWare became pure ridiculousness.

Exploring: “hmm I wonder if I can get over there?”

Exploiting: “holy crap it’s something that I know I’m not supposed to do, I need to get all my guildies and go do it so I can win the internet”

There’s a big difference, if you don’t understand it then you need to be using that computer to study for a GED instead of playing video games.

What’s ridiculous is that you still take the time to complain about it. It really is worse than anything Bioware can do. See they are a company, that makes video games, if you don’t like those video games, or the company that makes and sells them, you can just NOT PLAY. Find something else. Seriously.

They have to take actions or if they leave the crazies do sht they are not suppose too sooner or later there will be a totally crazy situation and millions of complains from a lot the players.

So it was a good thing to address this issue fast.

The best is to wait till Monday, its not like a month anyway, when everyone will have the access to play ball.

How many of you people are willing to see this as it is? Passionate gamers, taking down a boss with all mechanics – while proving a point to BioWare about GETTING THEIR SHIT RIGHT.
The passageway was reported on the PTS and they did not fix it for Live or postponed going Live with it. Sending messages to BioWare by doing such things is the only way to tell them that we want quality. Wanna limit an area for XXX time/days? Sure, go ahead, but make sure it’s fucking limited.
BioWare and EA’s quality in SWTOR and their “testing” and “please report bugs” don’t do shit, if they don’t fix it when reported. POOOOOOOR lack og game management! KUDOS to all the guys in there, i enjoyed the time for one – and the thrill of being there while laughing on TS about “YET ANOTHER BW FUCKUP” was a great time. Let’s all remember that they “fixed” Nefra 4 times, and it still isn’t fixed …

I see this for exactly what it is. A little boy, hand red after he got it slapped because it was found in the cookie jar before dinner. Sulking and simpering, salty tears on his puffy cheeks saying he didnt know he couldnt have a cookie, even though he knows hes not allowed up on the counter. You got your cookie, dry your tears. Now, go to your room.

Passionate gamers my ass. Reality hits you hard on this bro.
Exploiting always means to harrass your fellow gamers while most of the time getting huge advantages yourself. Just f#ck off.
There are people out there who are aware of glitches and possible exploits and they won’t for the life of it abuse them – it’s called legit gaming. No wonder you guys are so full of sh#t.

“But we said to fix it!”

People think marijuana should be legal, and they are mostly right. Hell, in Washington State and Colorado it is!

However, whip out your pipe, take a drag, and blow it into a cops face and see what happens.

Pretty sure you will be kissing pavement before you know what happened.

The point:

Bioware has already brought out the ban hammer in recent months over the exploits after the Christmas release SOR. This was intended to set the precedent, and confirm once and for all its position on exploits. Summary is, if its not intended as the finished product, and you are benefiting unfairly against the greater community, than you are by definition in violation of the User Terms and Agreements that all users agree to prior to downloading and using their software. This is the point of the statements above. Just because you disagree with something it does not justify your actions if it is in blatant violation of the “law” or terms in this case. If I disagree with iPhone prices, I cannot smash a store display and take the phone. That is still illegal.

I am willing to see this as it is. Children, thinking they have the “right” to stick it to Bioware (which is equivalent to god for all rights and purposes when within SWTOR.) than getting pissed off when they get banned and lose their shit. Sorry, what the fuck did you think would happen?

So you are in a way holding back from your true sociopath behavior i.e. smashing a store display or exploiting the game? Who let you into the gene pool? Raising Caine?

Yeah I’m sure you did it to send a message to BW. Anyone that believes that is as stupid as you are for saying it. Idiot.

Apparently you didn’t read the whole thing. It says clearly in the article “Some of you brought this issue to our attention on PTS and we thank you for that. We closed that opening, but it seems that there is another method of getting into the area.”

They fixed the one that was brought to their attention on the PTS, this isn’t the same one.

Passionate? How about predictable repeat exploiters always looking to break the game and get away with it.

I would just love to see these brave gamers willing to stick it to BW for releasing bugged content do these things and bring up the same defence in WoW…

This game needs a couple of high profile perma bans to put the fear of the hammer into people. Of course we have an issue with bugs, BW basically allowed hunting for exploits to become a major part of game play.

Blizzard don’t fuck around with this. Now, neither does Bioware.

Second, I keep hearing this about bugs. And yes, when I first fell through the guild ship into open space I really was like WTF. Then I did 3 more times cuz it was fun as hell. I been at this game since Beta.

Cortanni was a bit of a problem, but its been getting better. Nefra finally got the nerf that broke the exploit. But tbh, I saw WAY more bugs from ESO, so I really feel this is something certain gamers get fixated on, but bugs is the nature of video games. Especially when we are talking the scale of MMO’s. These things are information and code MONSTERS man, there is a lot going into this. Anyone familiar with programming knows how precise you have to be, and even when the code is right, it sometimes doesn’t synergize well with similar functions working in tandem.

WoW is polished, but its been running on the same platform for a decade, I sure hope a majority of bugs are worked out by then.

This producer needs some balls for sure. I agree that some publicized perma-bans would go a long way toward making the community as a whole in this game better. I’m quite sure BW isn’t going to lose enough money that they’d even notice.

Some public naming and shaming would go a long way, too. I know I wouldn’t have anything to do with a guild if I knew they had 24 members perma-banned for exploiting. Public embarrassment is a great way to keep people honest.

well this blew up fast but then again all those tears about stupid exploiters here is amazing what did you think? that you could get away with it again? not this time buddy this time you are being punished hard and i will personally seek out players in game and name and shame them and their pathetic guilds that did this

your kind of players are not welcome no matter if you pay money

what a surprise zorz is trying to get an upper hand. The way the world goes round is simple. EA says
1. exploit is found
2. EA claims “exploiters will be punished”
3. exploiters get off scott free for the most part
4. everyone who didn’t exploit observes and decides exploiting has no downsides, the potential gains far outweigh the gain and they vow to exploit the next thng to pop up
5. EA punishes the no-names and celerbrity guilds get off scott free (you really think they will risk losing people who get them money?)

I know a 3 day ban can be considered a lot by some standards but will they really learn??? there needs to be an incremental step up for mass exploiters, yes they do exist I’ve met a few of them in my time playing, people who have made millions from exploits and only recieve a slap on the wrist and 3 day ban each time. I’m not saying a first timer should be slapped with a month long ban but maybe extend it to a week and strip them of more than just what the earnt?? kind of like a fine system maybe take away credits or a 50% reduction in credits/comms etc earned account wide for a period of time.

This way they can keep playing, EAware get their money for monthly subs AND they get more than a slap on the wrist

And you, good sir, will get a bugged instance boss on monday. Enjoy. It is not thoroughly tested and trust me, it WILL bug. No contact from BW yet about if we found any bugs in there – we did though, have fun Monday, i’ll be there … on Ziost … laughing at why your group can’t get in same instance

“we were quality testing it” is one of the worst excuses I have ever heard for exploiting to gain access to locked content, go home and come up with a better excuse

Truth be honest, a 3 day ban and loss of gear is very fair on this exploit. It was not as serious as Ravagers. I think it was handled just right.

Deleting the toons that did the exploit and forcing them to start over with legacy perks removed on the account followed by a 10,000 credit cap.

God, I’m loving all the stupidity I’m reading.

Same issues that happened with the Ravagers, although this is much less serious and much better handled. But all of you people blaming Bioware for your bans for failing to fix it in time is what it really pissing me off. After all, you made the choice by going in. No one told you to go in the hole to the boss. If you didn’t go in there, you wouldn’t get banned. It was YOUR choice to break the TOS (which is Terms of Service for people who don’t know and you signed it when making an account) and do that. Common sense should have told you not to go in a forbidden area, which sadly a lot of people lack. Someone will argue with me, putting the blame on Bioware, but I’m not going to waste my time on them. YOU broke the TOS, and you can’t blame Bioware for doing the right thing.

Peace, love, off to bed. ๐Ÿ™‚

Yeah, OK, you had NO idea it wasn’t an area you weren’t supposed to be, and content you weren’t supposed to be able to play yet. My ass.

Same as ravagers and SAME PEOPLE DOING IT and trying to cajole the herd into thinking they are somehow a victim. They know what they are doing and they get caught they claim ignorance.

Lot of people here for some reason think guys getting banned are complaining/whining about the punishment. This is whats funny to me. I didn’t know/care about this exploit and I don’t care to find out how to do it, but I could care less that people are doing it. Its obvious though, that those complaining that did take part are not complaining about the punishments. They are complaining about Bioware’s extreme lake of putting out quality content once again. If this was news to Bioware after they released the patch, then maybe I could agree with them, but nope. Once again it was pointed out on the PTS and they released it as is anyways and then hide behind their TOS.

I can only hope that one day the gaming industry will get some legal scrutiny so players can get the same protections for services they pay for as they do almost all other products in the world. It just amazes me that these companies can still get away with almost anything considering how big the industry now is.

It says clearly in the article “Some of you brought this issue to our attention on PTS and we thank you for that. We closed that opening, but it seems that there is another method of getting into the area.”

They fixed the one that was brought to their attention on the PTS, this isn’t the same one.

I’m glad to hear that you believe that. I am done arguing in either case because if all it takes is a Bioware response where they can say w/e they want and that’s proof that I’m wrong then, well, time for me to move on.

In the mean time though, ask yourself if bypassing terrain is the exploit or killing a boss a week early? I hear a lot of people saying that people should clearly know they are exploiting based on bypassing terrain. Think about that for a minute. Think of a flashpoint or Operation or even class stories that you have done since this game came out and how many times you have done simple things to get past terrain to skip mobs. I could probably come up with at least one example for every flashpoint and Operation that exists in the game right now. Hell, I often get into combat just to /stuck to quick travel to a med center. All these things are what, ban worthy now?

I’m not going to say Bioware is wrong because of course they do have a ToS. I’m just going to say that some times its better for everyone to not enforce minor rules unless the benefits are worth it. Ravagers was clearly worth it, but they responded way too late. In this case, the only thing the people are getting is gear they earned, but a week early. I just don’t see how punishments are good for the community in this case. IMHO, they direction they are heading with how they deal with exploits is more like that of a Mom saying “Because I said so” than that of a company that is experienced in how to deal with exploits.

tldr; if you are so mad about the evil powers of industrial gaming megalomaniacs … stop playing video games – especially MMOs. It’s easy like that. Nobody forces you to play swtor or any evil BW games.
Yet you do – eventhough you got aware of the evil superpowers who are cutting all your hard earned money out of your rips in exchange for only pain and suffering playing their crappy ass games.
Darwin strikes back I guess.

Ahh, so instead of doing something I enjoy even though its flawed because I hope that over time it will get better, I should just stop. Good call:)

Where am I so mad btw, or was that the “You mad bro” response which is effectively the tell tale signal of trolling and I’m not up for following you there. I’ve stated my point of view but that’s about it. Hell, I’m actually not even playing this game really right now. I just think this whole thing is silly and I had time to spare while at work:)

Even if that wasn’t the internet I can’t take you seriously. Since this is the internet and nobody on the internet can be taken seriously you are quite lucky that your hippocrite nonsense posts do not do your appearence any harm.

Ya think bro? Whats wrong with a cyber feudalistic society run by self appointed boy king musco? Off with your head. Next.,.

Wait… they put a boss in game that you’re not supposed to fight until a wall comes down? A wall? Were they trying to get players to exploit? Am I missing something? Haven’t been in game for a while.

You really consider that getting ONE 204 rating item six days before they got it anyways is serious exploit? Or maybe useless commendations ? Those people defeated boss fair and square …. Corratani bug was much more serious. But I would do it every time I would have chance to . No matter of consequences.

I do yes. Its a violation of the agreement players sign when they start their account. There is no doubt in mind the violated it intentionally, the deserve punishment.

I dont care about punishment…. but really ? You will get this gear and everything on Monday so …. common exploit ? Killing boss fair and square without even knowing tactics ? Ban pfff…. ? If they only be so fast on fixing bugs…..

Lucky you, I don’t get to make the decisions. If I were the game producer, you’d be banned for life and your account deleted. Kind of like if someone that works for me broke into a closet and stole something. Even if it was something I was going to give you next week, your ass is fired.

Why? Because you proved: that your moral code (if you have one at all) is severely flawed, you have no respect, you’re dishonest, you’re selfish. You don’t want to conform to society, society should remove.

so i guess you consider killing Grim Toots on Makeb as exploit ? Or maybe you know legit way to kill it ? It has been released 2 years ago and still impossible to kill it “legit” way ? That’s how bioware spits in your face and you think its raining.

Perhaps you should read up on what an exploit actually is in game terms. People assume that it has to be something that has a terrible effect on the game. It can be, but doesn’t have to be. It is about the principle of the thing because in the end when is it a small issue and when is it a big issue? People will always have different opinions on that so there should be a clear line…it was not intended this way so don’t use it. If you do use it, it’s an exploit, no matter how grave the consequences are or not. The level of punishment then takes into account what the severity is. In this case I think a 3 day ban and taking the gear/comms back is fair. Sadly the reaction of the offenders is that they don’t take it seriously. That is their choice but the next time it won’t be their first offence anymore…that also makes a difference.

These are the same people doing their repeat behavior. They will not admit it but they also participated in past exploits and decried any wrongdoing.

‘You left the tiger cage unlocked so I walked in. It’s your fault bioware”

It’s not a heavy exploit, that’s why the sanctions are so light. You just lose your ill-gotten gains and a few days of playtime. You thought you were getting a few days ahead of everyone by cheating, instead you get a few days behind by being banned. Both proportional and fitting in my opinion.

I will get items and achievements anyway on Monday. But my question is will those Bioware idiots also remove character lockout ? If not I’m fine … after ban I still gonna have 2 or 3 unlocked characters

Well they sorta inferred that repeat behavior will have penalties escalated. I’m okay with it cause it’s usually those same types that need to run 174 geared premades in unranked wz’s 24/7 to pug stomp. Get rid of them and make the game better for all.

Oh. Biofail raids again. I just wonder about stupidity of their test team and ignorance of devs, when they were told about this bug. So lets call incompenence of BW as an expoloit, punish all the bad guys with bans and whatever else and hope not many players will think BW has no idea how to deal with a problem. Anyway, if there will be some negative wave about this, we can still nerf something to move the discussion further. So mature, so professional … If anybody cared more, I would be OK with it, but comeon, this is ridiculous. P.S. I never did any “exploits” as I don’t have spare time to explore those and just get know of sonething from this dumbo musco.

Learn to read: “Some of you brought this issue to our attention on PTS and we thank you for that. We closed that opening, but it seems that there is another method of getting into the area.”

You know there is no opening … the way to get there is way more easy. Potato brain developers didn’t think that getting close enough to this area and dying will respawn you in med center inside this “forbidden” area. And then killing boss in FAIR fight is considered as exploit by those muppets from BioCrapWare . I hope banhammer will strike me too because I managed to do it on several characters and still didn’t get punished.

Let me quite what I said above: “having done level design as a hobby for many years I can tell you this: No matter how many times you go over things, no matter how many times you check things, when you release there WILL be someone who finds something that you didn’t. It is a simple fact.”

The game needs less people like you, sir. you would do us decent folk a huge favour by leaving and not coming back.

If i buy a car i expect it to be tested, not every time i blink the headlights twice, turn my left turn signal and sound the horn 3 times and the car explodes into a fireball. SO, who is responsible, me for doing all that stuff or the manufacturer, who did not tested the car properly?

This is more like taking your whole car apart, and then complain that the warranty is no longer valid. If they didn’t want you to take it apart, why did they make it so easy to reach all these bolts holding the thing together?

Don’t be a moron. If you want to have all these metaphors in place of a real arguement, you could at least try to follow along. Instead of bathing in fallacy.

It seems again some people here are insistent on blaming Bioware, usually claiming that it is their fault for ‘not testing it properly’.

Well having done level design as a hobby for many years I can tell you this: No matter how many times you go over things, no matter how many times you check things, when you release there WILL be someone who finds something that you didn’t. It is a simple fact.

One thing is hobby, other thing is PAYD job, some people got sued for not doing their JOB right.

It is practically impossible to find every bug in level design before release, there will always be people who try things you didn’t think of, or see things you missed, and believe me I was as thorough as it was literally possible to be and always had beta testers and still some bugs slip through!

I haven’t yet downloaded the patch or tried out 3.2 yet, but is the Operation Boss not instanced? If not, shouldn’t it be (if it’s an operation boss and not world boss)?

It’s pretty dumb that people are exploiting, and they are the most at fault… But BW should really try even harder to prevent people doing stuff like this, especially after Rav.

That’s like saying bank robbers are bad, but it’s still kind of the bank’s fault for having so much money.

The area was closed off and they purposely bypassed the geometry to get at stuff they weren’t supposed to access yet.

I’m not sticking up for the exploiters, and if you read my post you would know that i believe they are 90% to blame. However, BW could have prevented it and should have ensured the area couldn’t be accessed, especially after the Rav exploit.

So by that logic you should avoid brushing your teeth as you will swallow the whole tube of toothpaste and get fluoride poisoning. I mean it’s Crest and Colgates fault that you were made available an entire tube in the first place right?

Must have trouble with reading compression, then. They’ve explained it several times. I fail to understand why waiting six more days for a little game content is such a big deal to some people.

Yeah my reading compression sucks. My reading comprehension on the other hand is great, and this was an epic failure of BW to communicate that there was going to be delayed content or give a reasonable explanation as to why.

Commentary from an exploroiter

Exploring new planets and instances is always fun, great fun even with a group of players and friends. We came across the gateway to the additional Ziost instance more by chance than anything else (not knowing where and how to get there, it is easy to imagine to spend not hours but significantly longer to really make it there). Once one of us got there, the temptation was too big to not go and have a look and the temptation was still bigger standing in front of the operation entrance for the new instanced world boss.

To my mind at least, there was little doubt that we were not supposed to be there (yet) as there are no mobs around except less than a handful of champion mobs (that do not drop anything of importance) and the roaming worldboss (that drops some potentially farmable items, notably a decoration, but quite interestingly also applies a 5h buff protecting against some form of ‘ancient’ alchemy…). Honestly speaking though, the thrill to test, work and figure out the new operation content – for most if not all the people who came along in that first group that killed the boss HM are longstanding progression raiders and friends – was certainly too big to not try. I can say at least for our group that the focus and interest was squarely on working the content without prior knowledge rather than looking for some way or other to farm materials to the disadvantage of others. Were it the latter we would certainly also not have told others.

Did we expect to keep the mainhands, decorations and achievements? Not really, at least not to my mind. We certainly can collect those again comparatively easily. Was it exploiting? In a strict rules of conduct sense, no doubt yes as there was at least the potential opportunity to farm some items. In comparison to the Ravagers exploit though this was certainly milder in a number of ways. Is Bioware to blame? Possibly to some extent as this discussion would be moot without access to the area though I would argue that testing everything to 100% or close to 100% perfection renders a product considerably more expensive and tardy. Was the penalty fair? I would consider it proportional and also think Bioware has responded quite well and much faster than with the ravagers exploit. Would I do it again? I am not entirely sure honestly. The 1-3 day suspension is not necessarily an incentive-altering penalty for everyone but it is a signal. The temptation to see and figure out new content is also not small (the number of whispers and requests for details from others would suggest that access by others would have spread quite rapidly). However, Bioware is beginning to draw the lines more clearly and visibly in the sand in applied cases and that’s good.

First sensible one of your group to PST so far. Are you honest or just placating? I guess we all have to form our own opinion. At least you appear to take responsility for the consequences of your actions.

This kind of sympathy story may have worked with your parents when you stayed out past curfew with the girl next door but it won’t hold water with the eric musco next door.

It’s not like you couldn’t have waited 6 days, stayed out of school that morning and get the server first anyway.
No sympathy. Though I couldn’t care less about some individuals getting their precious items or meaningless achievements, I approve BW taking more and more actions against exploiting.
While this case might not have hurt anyone – all the other commonly known exploits especially regarding pvp annoy so many people that it is indeed game breaking from time to time.

I’d rather see 100 players who heavily abuse these mechanics banned forever than having to play with or against them, even it this means even less populated servers – who cares?

Exploring is one thing killing the world boss is another.

And is Monday so far away that people couldnt wait for it ?

Just an unnecessary craziness thats all.

The content is instanced?

The content is not to be available until May 4th?

I knew nothing about this “exploit” before I came here, but it seems to me Bioware is at least 50% at fault. Their programmers are incapable of locking out the instance until May 4th? Why? There are instance-checks constantly in this game. They could not: (a) add a date check; (b) lock access until until a ultra-small patch on the 4th? Why? I was a programmer, and neither is an onerous burden or complicated task. On top of that they ALREADY have various checks in-game now for class and personal progression. The more I think about it the more I think their burden is greater than 50%.

Why are so many people happy to let BW off with a pass on just about everything? Yeah, the Ravagers thing (I was not playing at the time) seemed to be more of an obvious exploit, but again the speed with which BW responded left them partially at fault I would say, objectively.

In relation, I guess I am a fool, but I recently found out a huge number of schematics are still broken. When I quit a couple years ago I was aware of it, but had made the error of assuming known issues would be resolved in a couple years. Nope! I was told by a GM to keep an eye on the patch notes. I felt like replying, “it has been two+ years, are you kidding?” Again, I assume the community is aware but has given them another free pass. Why? I would wager the vast majority of you are not only paying subscribers, but also regularly buy from the Cartel Market, further lining their pockets.

This is the overall problem with the modern consumer with respect to software of any sort in general. It can be seen in everything from operating systems to games. Buggy code that is rushed to market, potentially resulting in consumer loss of data, privacy, and even hardware, but no one takes the software designers to task, and the vast majority just shrug it off.

Having an expectation of a reasonable level of quality in things you spend your hard-earned money on is not unreasonable. Placing some burden on the supplier of said things is not unreasonable. Expecting the supplier to take some level of responsibility for their products is not unreasonable.

Is the content still accessible? Why? What other MMO would not have immediately re-patched, removing the issue? I have played many MMOs, and groaned like everyone else when the post-patch messages would be spammed to “log out now, emergency patch” due to patch-introduced exploits.

I find it sad. I find the community in this game very odd.

It is indeed odd. The community lashes out like caged tigers when BW labels something an exploit, but not at the developers that screwed it up. The wrath is saved for the people that enjoy accessing content early. I think it’s a superiority complex. A lot of people here just like to assume they are better than the so-called exploiters.

I tend to agree – am also a Software engineer, though not in the gaming industry.

If they want an area to be blocked, why don’t they make it an exhaustion zone? Or place some mob like at the gray secant that insta-kills everything on sight? Or add an invulnerability buff to the boss? Or just remove the loot table from the boss which appears to be the big thing everyone is whining about. Plus, it should be even easier to block an instance, which has a very defined entry point by design.

Thinking about it, I would like the boss buff best. Players are told RP-wise to not go there because the evacuation is ongoing. If they still do, fine, but they will be blasted away. On May 5, make up some RP explanation why the boss is suddenly vulnerable (if totally uninspired, call it a disturbance in the force…).

I’m not saying BioWare doesn’t have good justification for their policy. Exploiting is a violation of their ToS and they gave a fair warning with their response to the Ravagers exploit.

I guess my question is: If someone in the game is running around with Rating 204 gear four days early, that negatively impacts your game how exactly? Like, how does it actually effect your game if they have a 192/198 MH versus a 204 MH today? Explain how that makes it a negative experience for you. I’ll wait. ๐Ÿ™‚

Another thought, but along the same lines:

1) Going to places you aren’t supposed to in…

a) Halo (an online multiplayer game where up to 16 players can play together in a competitive/cooperative environment): Considered awesome and celebrated by the community and encouraged by the game company.

b) The Old Republic (an online multiplayer game where up to 16 players can play together in a competitive/cooperative environment): Considered an immoral, cheating exploit only done by those with no character and the practice is viciously attacked and punished by the community and the game company.

I don’t know guys, I tend to have more of a live and let live philosophy. Someone figured out a work-around for your lockout timer, got a group together, learned the mechanics of your boss encounter and defeated it in less than 48 hours? I honestly don’t have an issue with it. It doesn’t effect my game any. Going places you aren’t supposed to, speed runs, unconventional strategies and exploits are how some people have fun playing a game. As long as they aren’t bothering you in your corner of the sandbox, who really cares?

Technically it’s an early unfair advantage. And if they don’t do something now it would set a bad precedent for the future.

We need to distinguish between behavior that harms the community and game economy versus an instance like this that does not. Bioware made the choice to label this an exploit when they did not have to and should not have done so. Unfair advantage? Not really as anyone that knows the trick or spends time figuring it out as others have can do it. Now they would be punished, but again only because BW chose to do so.

No – we certainly don’t have to distinquish. Abusing bugs and glitches IS forbidden not only bei EULA but also by common sense.
It can never be justified by wether it harms other player or not – this is utterly stupid.
i.e. if you find some glitch which enables you to powergrind millions of credits in a short time you still abuse a bug. And while not harming anyone directly you still have an advantage, you still haven’t played the game the way it’s meant to be.

If you people don’t like a game the way it is you can either complain about it and wait for it to maybe change. Or you leave it. Harrassing other players by exploiting is just silly. And you all know it.

Back in the days exploiters know what they did and at least they stfu when they got their perm bans, made some shiny flash videos of their actions and amused themselves and everyone else. You guys are just like some unmature little brats who don’t even know.

How on earth have you been harassed by someone else doing an instance and fighting an OPS boss? In what was has that actually effected you? Still waiting for a White Knight to answer my initial question.

If you didn’t get it by now there’s no hope you’ll ever get it. I certainly will not serve you some personally affected answer to a stupid question. This is one of these debates of principles that aren’t worth disscussing from your point of view (that is: it’s ok to exploit/cheat whenever you don’t harm anyone) not only because your point of view is just silly and shows no basic understanding of either moral nor simple rules, but mostly because it’s regarding a silly video game.

Maybe you can impress your school teacher by pulling of some discussion like this.

Anyway, here’s your White Knights answer: This ain’t no anarchy dude! Eventhough I get that even today it’s kinda cool to be a badass internet punk who doesn’t care sh#t about common rules/sense as long as it servers some stupid anarchic so-called philosophy. o_O

You know what isn’t cheating or exploiting? When someone “needs” on every drop regardless of what it is. It’s not cheating. It’s not an exploit. It something you can do in the game. That interaction, to me, is a negative experience in the game. Running past someone on the fleet who has better gear than me because they accessed an instance 4 days before BioWare intended is not a negative experience. In fact, I probably am not even going to notice.

See there is no “morality” in playing an online game. It’s not like walking through walls you are not intended to is objectively evil. Regardless of whether you “profit” from it or not. It really doesn’t matter. Harassing another player just to make them feel bad? That’s wrong. That’s evil. Getting some friends together and playing content early? Sure it’s a ToS violation, but the ToS are not some document that talks about what is “right” and what is “wrong.” They are rules that you agree to, and are subject to when playing the game. But let’s not pretend that they encompass some sort of moral code.

That’s why in my first post, I pointed out that BioWare has the authority and documentation to backup their decision. That doesn’t mean I personally care if someone cheats as described in this situation. Because… I don’t. Because there isn’t anything wrong with it. The folks that played this content gave their cash to BioWare just like everyone else. They played the content early because they came up with a solution to do that. When a fictional character does that in Star Trek, he is a hero. When someone does it in a video game for their own personal pursuit of happiness, they are a cheating exploiter that is just trying to get an unfair advantage.

Of course, I guarantee you actually ask the cheater/exploiter if they care if anyone else uses the exploit and gets a 204-piece, they won’t care. And if they don’t care, then they weren’t doing it for an unfair advantage. That’s just what you projected onto them to justify your so-called moral outrage.

Of course there is all kinds of unfair advantage in the game as it is. Subscribers have a myriad of convenience features that free-to-play players don’t have. Characters that are a higher level have access to more content and better gear. How is it fair when I slogged through Taris with no speeder and no sprint when the game was first launched and now people get 12x Story EXP? How is it fair that at launch, in addition to subscription fees, I actually had to buy the game for 50 dollars when any clown can get it for free now? “Fair” doesn’t exist in the real world, or any fictional world either.

In fact, speaking of “unfair” things at launch. How is it fair that I got to play the game four days early at launch, when someone buying a physical copy had to wait in line at GameStop at midnight the day of release? Because it’s okay when BioWare lets people play the game early on their terms, but if they are neglectful in their coding and someone doesn’t follow “their plan” for content release and play the game a few days early that’s a big problem? It wasn’t a problem when subscribers could play Shadow of Revan content early.

Throw me a bone here. Was the “sin” against BioWare because they said “no” and some folks did it anyway? Is that what makes it “wrong?” The implication is that BioWare’s decisions have some kind of moral content. They don’t. They have reasoning behind them for sure, and BioWare has more than a right to enact policies to reinforce their decisions for any reason that they want. It’s totally fine. Just don’t try and tell me you are morally outraged because there is no moral issue.

Also, not sure where the rant on anarchy came from, but it didn’t answer my question. At all. Like, not even close. My question was: How does it negatively effect you? Likening a dozen people doing content 4 days early to complete no-rules mayhem is absolutely ridiculous. I have played MMOs with no-rules mayhem. Players were able to corrupt other player’s characters, changing their stats, changing their looks, replacing them with NPC characters, killing them in non-PvP areas, stealing their weapons, create weapons with impossible statistics to 1-hit every enemy in a room, give their characters impossible stats so they could never die. I’m sorry, but I know what it’s like for the devs to ignore their game. And the situation described in Dulfy’s post? That’s not it.

Also, you didn’t answer my question. ๐Ÿ™‚

Again tl;dr. I won’t answer your question. You clearly show that you do not understand.
To make this very short: The moment you abuse a bug/glitch you exploit and the moment you exploit you violate the EULA and the moment you violate the EULA you should get officially punished. End of story. Finally face reality instead of posting walls of text that mean exactly nothing (I suppose).

If you aren’t going to bother reading my post and responding to – and directly addressing – the content therein because it’s a waste of time, then why bother posting a response at all?

And let us talk about time wasted. Your position is that people that break the ToS should be punished according to the ToS. That’s fine. I acknowledged that in the first paragraph of my first post. So if that is the only point you intend to make, then I would submit your posts – while shorter – are a bigger waste of time then mine, since the only point you are making is one that I already made before you even jumped in this thread.

The point I am discussing is not whether rules should be enforced, or whether or not a rule was broken. What I am discussing is whether or not anybody did anything “wrong.” We can all cite the ToS. No one is debating that. My posed question is: Did anybody actually do anything “wrong?” I haven’t gotten a satisfactory answer. Any answer really. You are content to answer questions not asked by making points that are already well-established. Your contribution to this discussion has been zero.

Boastfully pointing out that you are ignoring my posts and not contributing to the discussion isn’t really anything to be proud of. I imagine someone is watching a movie, maybe having a discussion about it and then you burst into a room, talk about a related video game, screaming your points over everyone else, then smugly pointing out that you are ignoring everything everyone else is saying and that they might as well not talk like adults because you aren’t going to listen. I mean, does that attitude really make you feel good about yourself?

My recommendation is, if you aren’t interested in discussing the topic with me – then just don’t. Don’t post a comment in a thread to explain how you aren’t going to post a comment in a thread. Don’t post in a thread to say that you aren’t reading the posts that you are responding to. Why bother? Unless you are arguing (but not really) just for the sake of arguing. We viciously agree that a rule was violated and BioWare should punish them. But that’s not what I wanted to talk about it. If you don’t want to talk about what I brought up, you can keep yelling over me, fingers in your ears, or you can move on with your life. I’m sorry I’m wasting so much of your time with these lengthy posts, but feel free to ignore them yeah? I would argue you are wasting your own time with your half-hearted responses that add nothing to the topic.

Oh, you thought I was done? Nope. Now let’s discuss the contents of your response.

Cheaters are generally assholes and morons? You don’t demonstrate this at all, you just make an assertion. Then again you haven’t demonstrated how a cheater interferes with your game, so I’m likely not to get an answer on how a cheater is an asshole. It’s your opinion, that’s cool, it would just be nice if you COULD actually back it up. You can’t, or you would have answered the question I posed days ago.

Your last paragraph is mostly a personal attack on me. I am “whining” about being treated unfairly and apparently people that laugh at others shouldn’t be, I don’t know, called out for being ridiculous. If you maybe provided a reason for how these cheaters harmed you, then maybe I could understand why you think it’s amusing that they got punished.

Generally speaking you want people to be punished when they do something wrong. You have yet to articulate what they did that was wrong. In fact you have stated several times you refuse to state what they did wrong. Apparently breaking a rule is itself wrong, regardless of the validity of the rule or what the actual outcome is of breaking it. That’s fine, but you won’t even say that much. Again, the purpose of this discussion is to talk about personal belief, not the rather cut and dry ToS.

Your first attack though, about “whining” on a forum is ridiculous. The purpose of me explaining that someone can “Need” on all loot drops wasn’t because I’m in tears for not getting an Athiss Informant’s Jacket. The purpose of it, was to illustrate a point. The point was that in an objective moral code, being selfish or greedy, is wrong. However, it cannot be punished. You explain this to me as if I didn’t explain it to you in the previous post.

The point I was making, which you seemed to not comprehend since you parroted back to me what I originally pointed out, is that being a jerk online isn’t against the rules. My point was, it still effects your game negatively. This is something you could say is “wrong.” However, the rule about exploits does not necessarily (but it can) effect the game negatively and it is being enforced. What I was trying to illustrate was that the rules, the ToS do not govern “right” and “wrong.” There is nothing wrong about slipping through a wall (until you can demonstrate it to me with a solid argument – or anyone else for that matter), but it is wrong to “Need” on a piece of gear that someone else could actually use, just because you want to sell it.

So again, where does the righteous fury come from? Where does it become funny to laugh at someone from getting what they deserve when they haven’t affected you at all? Likely jealousy. You would love to play the new content early, but you won’t. Someone else has what you don’t – early access to the content – and then you take a sick pleasure when they are “punished” for having what you don’t have. They deserve it! How dare they play something that I can’t play yet. Your “moral” outrage stems from your own greed and jealousy. Until you can supply with me an alternate reason, that is what I will choose to believe. It just makes the most sense.

Finally, let’s go back to the problem of “Needing” on gear you don’t actually “Need.” BioWare could have solved this problem at launch. It’s pretty simple. Each piece of gear is very obviously associated with a specific class or advanced class. Just give them first crack at the drop. If the player decides they don’t need it, then everyone else gets a roll on it, otherwise, no-dice. A double bladed lightsaber drops? Assassins get first crack. They don’t need it, then all Inquisitors get a crack. Any Inquisitors don’t need on it, then the rest of the group gets a crack. It wouldn’t be that complicated. Hell an even simpler solution would be to just reward the drop randomly to a group member and make it a class item for them. If they choose not to use it, then they can trade it to another group member. Again, pretty simple. Instead, assholerly is encouraged by the system in place.

So, again, BioWare, allows, perhaps even encourages – to a small degree – people acting like jerks. But no one can explain to me how a guild running an instance early is being a jerk to everyone else. I mean, if they never posted about it, you wouldn’t have even known about it to care in the first place. So again… how does that affect you?
Time is up. It’s 8am PDT. Now everyone can access the instance. Whatever moral outrage you have had for four days is no meaningless since everyone has access to the content now. The 72 hour bans on the players that violated the ToS are also over, so they are likely re-doing the fight an earning their rewards again as we speak. Of course they already know the battle so it’s probably not even an issue for them.
Have fun buddy, catch you around. ๐Ÿ™‚ And May the 4th be with you.

Seriously dude. What the fuck?
1. Yes it is wrong to abuse glitches and cheats to get advantages over anyone else. If you can’t see why – well that’s entirely your problem, wether you care or not.

2. Being a jerk in a video game is similar to being a jerk in general. I don’t see where BW or any other Developer encourages griefing, player harrassement, being greedy or unfair. Going back to your example:
Just because you CAN roll need on everything doesn’t mean you have to. There’s not a lot of common sense and social behaviour asked to understand this.
If you can’t think for yourself and if you need strictly outlined behaviour mechanisms that prevent you from being a jerk in every thinkable way you propably shouldn’t play MMOs. I know there are a lot of people who are not able to suit in. Most of them won’t make it even in a video game … because people WILL avoid them. That’s not BW fault.

3. After all being a jerk and cheating both will get you punished. You either get officially punished by violating the EULA/ToS or your fellow players will punish you socially-like. In my experience, be an asshole one time and people will remember. Be an asshole a second time and people will avoid you. Be an asshole in general and you will become some kind of virtual social outcast that gets focused in PvP primarily and really will have a hard time to find groups.

This is not a question about “right” or “wrong” in a philosophical way. If you seriously want to discuss on such a silly level (first time I read your whole post and it still looks like … omg what’s wrong with this guy?) you’re really at the wrong place and you SERRIOUSLY picked the wrong topic.
There is only right or wrong – common sense and rules define this.

It’s ok if you think it’s ok to cheat and grief in a video game, whenever nobody gets hurt directly – actually that’s another point in which you ARE wrong since whenever somebody violates game mechanics to get advantages or even just for the lols, the game experience gets worse and data will get corrupted. Only because you are not a direct “victim” of a bunch of hackers doesn’t mean “nothing happens it’s ok”.

In this recent case there where two bugs which you could’ve abused to get into the forbidden area. One of them had been reported to the devs while PTS testing and it was fixed before it went live. Another bug were NOT reported – it was abused (STOP – this is exactly the point where the ToS get violated, no discussion needed however the outcome) to get achievements and game experiences which you shouldn’t have gotten at this time. Most of them knew it was exploiting. What I don’t believe is that anyone of these guys expected to get punished for it. BW reacted well for not only getting there game exploited and there – however lazy designed it was – content corrupted by a bunch of jerks. They also made a point that they do not encourage exploiting. Personally I hope they will keep to it and punish all the other exploits especially in PvP. So – this is a good sign for anyone who wants to play and experience the game legit.

Just stop this man. You’re making a fool out of yourself.

In your example about powergrinding credits, yes, that affects the game economy so that would potentially be an exploit. I didn’t get a reply yet when I posted this before elsewhere, so I’ll ask you the same questions.

There’s a spot on Makeb that has a rancor behind a barrier that you need to kill if you want the achievement. Clearly it was designed to have some method of accessing that doesn’t exist to lower the barrier. Instead you have to cheat your way into it using a couple of different tricks. That was added into the game LONG time ago and still exists today in that same state. Exploit?

Using a guild flagship summons to get to the Makeb endurance datacron. Accessible in this manner since guild flagships were added. Exploit?

Being pulled up by sages/sorcs to access the fleet datacron, obviously circumventing the intended design of using the grappling hook tool. Some guilds even sell access to this or ask for tips. Exploit?

Using 3 people with one person spamming their click on Section X instead of the intended 4 for completing the last part of the Heroic 4. Exploit?

Those are just some examples I could think off the top of my head. I’m going to go out on a limb and assume all are bannable offenses to you and that you would NEVER do any of those things or anything similar that circumvents the obvious game design. Correct?

An exploit is an exploit. Nothing to argue about that. Either you make 100 Million credits by finding some hidden glitch or you kill a rancor behind a barrier (if that actually affords some cheap trick, I frankly don’t know nor care about).
It doesn’t matter wether I would do it anyway or not.

If you don’t know what an exploit is by now, feel free to google it. There’s only ONE definition and it cannot be interpreted a thousands ways.

Why cant you wait for the Monday as everyone else will ?
Is that too much to ask ?

Stupidity gets punished and it should be so next time these players will play smartly and patiently.

I can wait until Monday. I am waiting until Monday. But, if I decided not to wait until Monday, why would that bother you so much? And furthermore, how do you arrive at the ridiculous conclusion that someone accessing an instance early is “stupidity?” What does intelligence have to do with being excited to play new content?

It’s not stupid to find glitches and bugs – though let’s face realitiy on this one, ok? It’s almost always by incident. Only usually you don’t start to think of how to abuse some bug.

What’s stupid, you ask? Stupid if for example – and I mean big time stupid – to justify obvious and officially punished offenses of the agreement (EULA) everyone has accepted – and moreover common sense.

You know what you did pal. Now go down to the town square. Remove articles of clothing let them tie you to the pillar and whip you in front of everyone in the community. Shame and guilt will be your allies in the force.

Someone shouts on fleet for Ziost world boss. Haven’t completed Ziost yet, but I like to raid so I say sure. Get invited into ops group. Ask how to get to World Boss. Don’t worry they say we will summon you there, easier and faster than everyone trying to make it on their own.

Seems legit, most pug groups I run with operate that way. Summoning happens. Find myself in a phased area, fight boss, kill boss. Ops leader than writes in OPs chat: “HAHAHAHA Welcome to the banned list muppets. We tricked you into exploiting. HAHAHAHA.”

24hrs later get a 72 hr ban…

Sure nothing heavy handed or unfair about that.

Yes.
I have appealed said suspension. The last I spoke with customer service, 3hrs ago from time of writing, they said that they would probably reverse the decision when they are done the full investigation of my appeal.
However, they have been inundated with appeals just like mine, and they are not sure that they will be able to finish all of the investigation before the suspension expires.
Either way once it has been cleared, then I need to call customer service and depending on amount of time I have been wrongly locked out I will be compensated with game time, cartel coins ect…
Doesn’t help my raid team or my guild… But at least they are admitting that they have made a colossal error(pun intended).

Once again Bioware screws ambitious players! And Bioware wonders why they lose their player base. Bioware should be excited about players who spend time figuring out these nicks. These are the players you want to keep, not these whiny goody two shoes, who are too lazy to figure out how to do cool things!!!

Oh noes! I hope BW will apology their mistake to punish these ambitious geniuses we all are so fond of. Hopefully they will last for many many years to come, finding new ways to screw anyone else over. I can’t really imagine the internet without these nice people.

No … seriously. lmao. It’s getting better every single pro-cheater post.

Besides, here’s a cool thing to do: Restart your system into prompt mode. Type: /format c: . Enjoy your shiny real life.

We did find out we were in the secluded area after killing it on SM.
We went HM anyway, fully aware of the risks ๐Ÿ™‚ Everyone is taking their bans. Yes, Bioware release content live that is not even tested properly, but everyone did – at one point – realize that it was not a good place to be. We risked it for the sake of it and pointing out to BW that we’re tired of broken content going live, every. single. time.

Goodbye – have fun playing Star Citizen’s 1/2 dogfight game mode with your assets worth 300 US Dollar (or more). Not that there was actually any point you could compare SWTOR to Star Citizen (apart from being a spacey game).

You are not the brightest of all these stars here … are you?

I’m sure Bioware will be crying over a whiney little cry-baby that rage quit because he got caught violating their terms of service which he agreed to when he signed up.

Bioware please stop!! It is your fault, not the players. Fire your software engineers, not your customers!

No i did not take part in this. i am on Bastion imp side. still playing, for the 2nd time. I just strongly disagree with the harshness of Bioware. It is not that difficult to get to the boss, and for someone who did not know ,because they do not read the forms, I can totally understand them not realizing they were doing something they shouldn’t.

Regardless of whether people knew or not about the exploit, it is still an breach in the TOS.

You notice how Bioware is giving week bans instead of 3 day bans now that everyone knows it is an exploit. People are getting banned for longer now that the accidental people have been caught. This was actually handled excellently by Bioware, IMO, than the Ravagers was.

But it is still the fault of the people who got banned for exploiting, not Bioware. You could be lenient to the first people who didn’t know, but common sense should tell you anyway that climbing over stuff to get to an area you didn’t have access to before is strange, and you should steer clear from it to be sure. There is ABSOLUTELY NO EXCUSE for someone to claim “I didn’t know” after that first round. Just a daily look at a web page will give you all the info you need.

I am certain that if Bioware put a clickable object in the game clearly labeled “BAN BUTTON”, with a tooltip stating “if you click this object you will receive a 30 day ban”, and an “ARE YOU SURE?” confirmation box, several thousand players would still click it, and then complain that it was Bioware’s fault for putting it in the game.

70+ hour ban, means 70+ hours of crap posts by people who cant play, and annoyed people stuck at work.

I think it’s fun to see that no banned person has been whining. It’s all the witchhunters who has been whining. Anyway, bans distributed, acquired gains removed – case closed

Well, to the last two post, I did not get my toon suspended or ban, and my main and my legacy is Echodalorian. I did not take part in this game design screw up. Look it up on last played. If you dont believe it is me. You can whisper me on Bastion Imp side. I will gladly invite you to our Teamspeak. Oh wait we dont allow anyone under 18 and/or IQ under 30 in our TS, sorry you can’t come.

You do realize you’re acting like a moron in the comments, right? There’s no way you’re an adult or at least a responsible one.

Bioware this is no exploit, you guys are wrong, wrong, wrong for doing this. Shame on you. You are destroying star wars. Please stop pointing blame and take responsibility for your screw ups.

Stop bitching like a little girl. You knew what you were doing, and you will pay for that, if you dont’ like it, you know where the door is.

Once again read below dip shit. I did not do the bioware, fuck up, world boss. I support those who did though. Grow a pair of balls, and dont let Bioware get away with bullying. Their f up they should take responsibility for it. Dont punish players who go the extra mile.

Clearly you have no idea what an exploit is and what you signed as part of the agreement for playing this game. As a side note, making 8 new comments about the same topic in a matter of hours doesn’t make you right, just annoying. But I’m sure that’s just my personal opinion.

Well, i mean i just checked it out this morning to see how people were doing it. It is pretty easy and i can totally see people doing it thinking it is just how you are suppose to get to the world boss. Shit you could do it by accident!

If you shoot someone on purpose it’s murder. If it’s by accident it’s manslaughter. Of course exploits are nowhere near as serious but there still is a punishment even if it’s on accident. The punishment is a lot less though. If you can understand the principle behind that, perhaps that explains why people got a 3 day ban and not permabans. It wasn’t the most serious of exploits but people do need to realise that hey broke a rule. Let’s be honest, all these guys that did it and bragged about it knew damn well what they were doing. That’s why there need to be rules and why they need to be enforced. It just didn’t need draconic measures and so it’s right that the punishment was not so severe.

OMFG!! Yay! Finaly Expoit Defender. I’ve almost loose fate in people. Phew that was close… But man u r totally wrong. This was an exploit and it will remain exploit till 4th may. So take your toys and go to other sandbox because every logical thinkin’ man knows that from very beginning that was a damn exploit

And, Oh My God, Bioware. We are talking about a PVE piece. Who cares? It is not like it was pvp gear or anything that mattered.

PvP really? Not everyone play PvP in this game. Beside u PvP players fuck up enough in PvE content because of your moaning.

I really dont want to have this argument. I will say this I have been running raids on swtor for 3 years now, I will take a person who pvp’s over a flash point buff any day of the week.
On a side note a Pve 198 geared toon will always get wooped by a 174 or 168 PvP gearede toon

So why race in a tricycle race when you can race a real bike. Unless you are handicapped? Just saying. ๐Ÿ™‚

Well no shit!!! The pvp gear is made to work against other players while the PVE gear isn’t. If you PVP peeps are so awesome, why can’t you just use the PVE gear, and whatever skills are out there? Instead I hear you all crying about how some classes are OP, and bla bla bla.

Anybody can memorize a raid. it takes a lot more skill to adapt to any situation, like in pvp. Do not mistake me though I love raiding, but you cannot compare the skill levels.

What’s wrong with that?

I play on a RP server and role-play regularly, I don’t do PvP. Nothing wrong with any of that.

Why is he an idiot? Is someone gonna go cry to Musco? Fuck off, this isn’t the swtor forums..
I wouldn’t do it now since they are watching for people (it will be fixed tomorrow), but you could sneak around a certain part of Ziost to get to the new operation bosses.

I, too, wonder how that was possible – and given that the content is now live (and the exploit pointless, even if it still worked), maybe we can have an emotion-free discussion about it..?

The way I understand the Ziost OP and World Boss, both are to be found only in the area of Ziost that you have to manually activate on the space station (and that activation was certainly not possible before 4th May).
How in the heck did people get there?

When first hearing about the exploit, I thought that you would be able to do some fancy jumping in that “landing zone” area which appears to have no use apart from having one of the Aegis walkers. After all, that zone did have some gates/forcefields (and it still does, uselessly!) and I would have thought to find the OP area behind one of those, with the gate/forcefield being opened on Monday. It sure did look that way to me.
But really… A wholly separate planet/area? How did people find out and how was it possible to NOT secure this properly?

What I still don’t understand is: were “exploiters” accessing the daily area only available after May 4th, or was there another copy of Monolith accessible through Quest area? If so, why would Bioware put the Operation Boss where it can be easily accessed??

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