Patch 3.3 patch notes SWTOR

SWTOR PTS Patch 3.3. Game Update Notes

SWTOR Patch notes for Game Update 3.3 on the PTS released on June 3, 2015.

Star Wars™: The Old Republic™ PTS
Game Update 3.3

All content and features on the Public Test Server are not final and are subject to change.

Classes + Combat
Jedi Consular

  • Noble Sacrifice has been redesigned and renamed Vindicate: Vindicate restores 30 Force and heals a friendly target. The cooldown has been removed and a 2 second activation time has been added.
  • All Sages will need to visit their class trainer to attain Vindicate.
  • Benevolence now has a base Force cost of 65 (up from 50) and its healing has been significantly increased.
  • Rejuvenate now has a base Force cost of 45 (up from 30) and its healing has been increased.
  • Force Mobility now additionally allows Vindicate to be channeled while moving.


  • Deliverance now has a base Force cost of 45 (up from 30) and its healing has been significantly increased.
  • Healing Trance now has a base Force cost of 60 (up from 40) and its healing has been increased.
  • Salvation now has a base Force cost of 75 (up from 60) and its healing has been increased.
  • Wandering Mend now has a base Force cost of 60 (up from 50) and its healing has been significantly increased.
  • The Noble Sacrifice effect of Resplendence has been removed and redesigned with Vindicate: Vindicate restores 5 additional Force and reduces activation time by 0.25 seconds for each of the first two Resplendence charges, or makes it activate instantly with the third charge. Consumes all charges.
  • Conveyance no longer highlights its associated healing abilities when active.
  • Increased the healing granted by Renewal after refreshing Rejuvenate on a target.
  • Amnesty has been redesigned: Vindicate grants Amnesty, healing the target over 6 seconds. This can only occur once every 15 seconds.
  • The Force-Mystic’s 4-piece set bonus has been redesigned: Consuming Darkness or Vindicate restore an additional 10 Force.

Sith Inquisitor

  • Consumption has been redesigned and renamed Consuming Darkness: Consuming Darkness restores 30 Force and heals a friendly target. The cooldown has been removed and a 2 second activation time has been added. All Sorcerers will need to visit their class trainer to attain Consuming Darkness.
  • Dark Heal now has a base Force cost of 65 (up from 50) and its healing has been significantly increased.
  • Resurgence now has a base Force cost of 45 (up from 30) and its healing has been increased.
  • Force Mobility now additionally allows Consuming Darkness to be channeled while moving.


  • Dark Infusion now has a base Force cost of 45 (up from 30) and its healing has been significantly increased.
  • Innervate now has a base Force cost of 60 (up from 40) and its healing has been increased.
  • Revivification now has a base Force cost of 75 (up from 60) and its healing has been increased.
  • Roaming Mend now has a base Force cost of 60 (up from 50) and its healing has been significantly increased.
  • The Consumption effect of Force Surge has been removed and redesigned with Consuming Darkness: Consuming Darkness restores 5 additional Force and reduces activation time by 0.25 seconds for each of the first two Force Surge charges, or makes it activate instantly with the third charge. Consumes all charges.
  • Force Bending no longer highlights its associated healing abilities when active.
  • Increased the healing granted by Renewal after refreshing Resurgence on a target.
  • Reverse Corruptions has been redesigned: Consuming Darkness grants Reverse Corruptions, healing the target over 6 seconds. This can only occur once every 15 seconds.
  • The Force-Mystic’s 4-piece set bonus has been redesigned: Consuming Darkness or Vindicate restore an additional 10 Force.


  • Medical Probe is now available to all Commandos at level 10. The healing dealt by Medical Probe has been reduced.
  • Advanced Medical Probe is now part of the Combat Medic Discipline and has been removed from all other Commandos.
  • The healing dealt by Med Shot has been reduced.
  • Target Lock now increases the critical chance of Medical Probe by 5%, but no longer increases the critical chance of Advanced Medical Probe.
  • All Commandos may want to visit their class trainer to make sure they have the highest ranks of all the affected abilities mentioned above.

Combat Medic

  • Advanced Medical Probe is now part of the Combat Medic Discipline, available at level 10. The healing dealt by Advanced Medical Probe has been increased.
  • Medical Probe has been removed from the Combat Medic Discipline and is now available to all Commandos. The healing dealt by Medical Probe has been reduced.
  • Quick Thinking has been redesigned: Quick Thinking now increases the critical healing chance of Medical Probe by 5%.
  • Field Medicine now increases the healing dealt by Medical Probe by 5%, but no longer increases the healing dealt by Advanced Medical Probe.


  • Charged Barrel now reduces the activation time of the next Medical Probe by 20% (instead of Advanced Medical Probe).

Bounty Hunter

  • Rapid Scan is now available to all Mercenaries at level 10. The healing dealt by Rapid Scan has been reduced.
  • Healing Scan is now part of the Bodyguard Discipline and has been removed from all other Mercenaries.
  • The healing dealt by Kolto Shot has been reduced.
  • Advanced Targeting now increases the critical chance of Rapid Scan by 5%, but no longer increases the critical chance of Healing Scan.
  • All Mercenaries may want to visit their class trainer to make sure they have the highest ranks of all the affected abilities mentioned above.


  • Healing Scan is now part of the Bodyguard Discipline, available at level 10. The healing dealt by Healing Scan has been increased.
  • Rapid Scan has been removed from the Bodyguard Discipline and is now available to all Mercenaries. The healing dealt by Rapid Scan has been reduced.
  • Med Tech has been redesigned: Med Tech now increases the critical healing chance of Rapid Scan by 5%.
  • Empowered Scans now increases the healing dealt by Rapid Scan by 5%, but no longer increases the healing dealt by Healing Scan.


  • Tracer Lock now reduces the activation time of the next Rapid Scan by 20% (instead of Healing Scan).


  • The healing dealt by Diagnostic Scan has been reduced.
  • Increased the immediate healing dealt by Kolto Pack, and reduced the healing dealt by its following duration heal.
  • Slow-release Medpac now costs 10 energy (down from 15 energy). The healing dealt by Slow-release Medpac has been slightly reduced.


  • Smuggled Med Delivery now additionally allows Diagnostic Scan to channel while moving.
  • Kolto Cloud now costs 20 energy (down from 25 energy). The healing dealt by Kolto Cloud has been slightly reduced.
  • The healing dealt by Underworld Medicine has been significantly increased.
  • Homegrown Pharmacology now increases the healing dealt by periodic effects by 5% (up from 3%), and Invigorated targets receive 5% more healing (up from 3%) from all sources.
  • Puissant Poultices no longer reduces the energy cost of Slow-release Medpac by 5.
  • Bedside Manner now increases all healing done by 5% (up from 3%) for 6 seconds when an Upper Hand is consumed by a healing ability.
  • The Field Medic’s 6-piece set bonus has been redesigned: Reduces the cooldown of Recuperative Nanotech or Kolto Cloud by 3 seconds.

Imperial Agent

  • The healing dealt by Diagnostic Scan has been reduced.
  • Increased the immediate healing dealt by Kolto Infusion, and reduced the healing dealt by its following duration heal.
  • Kolto Probe now costs 10 energy (down from 15 energy). The healing dealt by Kolto Probe has been slightly reduced.


  • Surprise Surgery now additionally allows Diagnostic Scan to channel while moving.
  • Recuperative Nanotech now costs 20 energy (down from 25 energy). The healing dealt by Recuperative Nanotech has been slightly reduced.
  • The healing dealt by Kolto Injection has been significantly increased.
  • Medical Therapy now increases the healing dealt by periodic effects by 5% (up from 3%), and Invigorated targets receive 5% more healing (up from 3%) from all sources.
  • Durable Meds no longer reduces the energy cost of Kolto Probe by 5.
  • Tactical Medicine now increases all healing done by 5% (up from 3%) for 6 seconds when a Tactical Advantage is consumed by a healing ability.
  • The Field Medic’s 6-piece set bonus has been redesigned: Reduces the cooldown of Recuperative Nanotech or Kolto Cloud by 3 seconds.


  • Warzone Commendation limit has been increased to 200,000.
  • Exumed and Dark Reaver Gear costs have been dramatically reduced and now cost Warzone Commendations.
  • Ranked Commendations have been removed from the game. All Ranked Commendations have been converted to Warzone Commendations.
  • New Season-specific Commendations have been added. These new Commendations are awarded for participating in Ranked Warzone Arenas, and have a limit of 1,000,000.
  • A Warzone Commendation Legacy Lockbox has been added to PvP Item vendors on the Fleets. This Lockbox can be used to transfer Warzone Commendations to Legacy characters. They cost 99 Warzone Commendations, and award 99 Warzone Commendations when used.
  • Warzone Experience and Credits have doubled.
  • Damage-dealing Area of Effect Abilities no longer interrupt Objective Capturing in Warzones. Crowd Control Area of Effect Abilities are not affected by this change.
  • The Defuser timer in Voidstar has been increased to 6 seconds.
  • Alderaan Civil War, Voidstar, Novare Coast and Ancient Hypergates will be the only Warzones active during PTS in the unranked queue in order to ensure testing of the Area of Effect changes.

By Dulfy

MMO guide writer and blogger. Currently playing and covering SWTOR, GW2, and TSW.

344 replies on “SWTOR PTS Patch 3.3. Game Update Notes”

I just threw up in my mouth, spit it up and spit on it.

This is what they call “quality of life” improvement

No, “quality of life improvements” would be things like being able to access your cargo hold from anywhere, or being able to summon your group to where you are, or ride a mount at lvl 1. These are mostly gameplay “improvements”.

They mentioned it in the past notes. These changes are all made by Bioware. Not pvp for once. it’s just part of their bulshit to “mix things up”

Again, quality of life improvement were Bioware’s own words to describe healing changes. Holyfrog is your source? Seriously? Please hide under a rock

Another patch with tons of changes that no one has asked for…
One would assume the Devs learned from the huge uproar after the last PTS patch, but no, not Bioware. -.-

I’ve really been enjoying playing the healing operative. I’ve been a religious dps diehard in every mmo I’ve played for all the years I’ve been playing. But with this 12x XP I decided what the heck. I know healing operatives are supposed to be the lowest of the 3 healing classes, but I just really enjoy playing it.

That being said, it seems like every time I see a patch note relating to healing operatives, they keep getting their healing values reduced. Not really sure the need for changes to any of the healing classes they’re talking about doing for that matter. Maybe I’m just not “Healer” enough yet to understand the complexities of it yet >.<

Op is a great class, even if it is sub-par in healing, if your tank companions are geared, you can mow through pretty much anything.

Unfortunately, the scoundrel and agent really got the hard shaft when heal spec, which started in the 75% damage reduction, then elimination of the OS ability.

You can thank the craptastic thing they call PvP in this game for majority of these changes, because Bioware would rather screw the community, rather than fix what needs to be done – separate PvP/PvE abilities.

The changes really don’t seem that bad overall, the new set bonus is a huge plus. How bad the changes are really depends on how much a ‘slight’ heal reduction for kolto probes and recuperative nanotech is. Remember, we’re getting a 2% boost to hots.

Except, I consistently put up better effective numbers than almost any healer I cross, with my op healer. Most of the notes above are also boost, the only nerf I see is to nanotech. The 6 piece set bonus may even be viable now (as opposed to running 4 new and 2 old set bonus)

Well, hps is generally really good as operative, but healing is hardly accurately represented in numbers. Burst can be very important in tight phases.

Yes, though, I have ran duel op groups that are able to handle it (admittedly not as well as an op and a sorc or even merc). Looks like the PTS changes right now aim to boost our burst ability, too (“Significant” boost to Kolto Injection). We will see 🙂

As a follow up, no, numbers are not everything. There are a ton of factors in it, though, if the other healers in group are half of your effective healing, I will say that you are probably doing a fairly good job overall at maintaining the groups hp. But yes, I definitely agree numbers are certainly NOT everything and not always important, either.

The best quality of life improvement would be a legacy bank. We already have guild banks that you can access funds from. Why can’t they apply that same method to your legacy so that you don’t have to mail credits back and forth depending on which toon you’re focusing on? Just have a legacy bank that all characters on your legacy share.

because it take’s entirely too long to mail yourself credits. *eye roll* 45 seconds between sending and logging to receive is far too long.

Altoholics need to transfer big numbers many times a week to get the gear they want for each character, and many times they can’t remember which one can afford it so there’s always some searching. Also the mail system can glitch and eat the creds away (customer service can refund them, but that takes time you want to spend playing).
Having one bank account for your entire legacy makes everything run a lot smoother and reduces needless relogging.
It would be a significant QoL improvement for us who have to juggle multiple characters.

Why do I have the feeling that polarity shift will now be the best way of emptying the force pool for good? :S

da fug is wrong with those guys??
Community was clearly against sorcs changes… And here we go again…
Dammit BW! Why are you so DUMB???

Well, force managment as a sorc is extremely easy, some kind of nerf was to be expected. Although they might be overdoing it, slightly increasing heal costs and reducing the force restored by consumption seems good enough.

slightly increasing heal costs? lol, in what math class did you learn that 20-30% increase is a slight increase?

I’m sorry if I wasn’t clear, I mean that slight increase in costs would have been enough and this seems excessive.

But force management as a lightning sorc is WAY easier than it is as a healer, especially if you don’t need to off-heal. I never bother with noble sac/consumption when on my light sorc / tk sage, it’s like I have unlimited ammo. Why isn’t that the first priority?

Pherhaps, I don’t know much about lightning, but these patches are pretty much for balancing healer specs, dps specs get very little change from this patch.

My preffered class being an operative healer in both ranked pvp and pve, I really can’t complain about these changes, provided that the heal reduction of kolto probe and recuperative nanotech are indeed ‘slight’. What I do not quite understand in the increase in heals for kolto inection, but I’ll take it!

Well where else is all the healing from the HoTs gonna end up if currently scoundrels are ‘ok’ at healing but need a burst healing buff? They aren’t gonna drop scoundrels healing enough for it to not be viable anymore, for one.

Well, considering we get a 2% boost to heals over time, a 2% to invigorate bonus heal and a 2% boost to tactical medicine, if the nerf to recuperative and kolto probe is indeed slight, that seems to even itself out. Seems like infusion is just moved around from the hot to the initial heal.

I swear we are trapped in some kind of time loop. I like noble sacrifice. It makes me not a trooper or a smuggler. I thought we had this exact discussion with Bioware already, and they backed off. But here we are again, trying to homogenise the classes again. All because some pvp jackass likes to pad his stats, like it matters or anyone cares. But, I guess it was bad enough to whine about, and here we are for round 2. Are we going to bark loud enough to scare them off again? Will it even matter? Will they not just come back with stupid ass homogenizing mechanics again in another 2 months? This is depressing.

This shows that they don’t listen to us at all. They pander, and wait, and then try to go ahead and do whatever they wanted anyway.

They backed off because they needed more time to test the changes. So what did this update do?

+15 force from Resplendence. Now made baseline to Noble Sacrifice
Set bonus being useless. Now makes Noble Sacrifice even stronger

Now all we need to see is how big the heal is. I like this change anyway cause its adding more burst to heals, and if they got Noble Sacrifice right this time, it also means that the sustained should stay about the same. And more burst is important, fights like the Coratani phase of Corratani + Ruuger, as well as the Colossal Monolith are very heals intensive, and a boost to burst healing will immensely help with that.

Though I don’t see any mention of Knockback protection for it… (Bioware plz add)

*checks patch notes*
*checks calendar*
*checks memory*
*checks patch notes again*

…also: I liked those highlights from Force Bending!

I will say the sorc changes are better than the original ideas. Still have to see it in practice, but I do hope that the sorc won’t feel too much like a merc healer with light armour and a couple of bubbles. Still, the previous ideas were much worse than this, so I am expecting that after some tweaking of the actual numbers on the PTS this might very well make it to the live servers.

They said they wanted to tweak the before they would go life. They never said they were completely scrapped and for the operative changes, these don’t look too bad.

“Alderaan Civil War, Voidstar, Novare Coast and Ancient Hypergates will
be the only Warzones active during PTS in the unranked queue in order to
ensure testing of the Area of Effect changes.” —– avoids PTS pvp haha


Look guys they finally realized that the new set bonus for Scoundrels/Operative healers is terrible

Yes, it’s probably the best thing about the update. I would have preferred them copying the old 2piece, but at least this one does something, especially with the reduced cost for recuperative nanotech.

why de fuck do they keep nerfing bounty hunters.
Im guessing the devs hate bounty hunters/mandalorians.

Wow….So much qq going on. Do you like your class? then play it. Stop complaining when things don’t go your way. It’s a game. They are messing around with things to see what works for everyone, not just a bunch of lifers.

There is the difference between “not going your way, but we will buff Sins” and “all the stuff you have is OP so we will reduce it and will buff Sins” (Sins because so far they have suffered very little to none nerfs, you know melee class with mass knockback ability and 30m interupt/mezz)
Your justification of them messing around is worth nothing really. I am paying for this game, so as many others, and I dont want to re-roll fucking AP every 7 days because they were messing around. And if you say now “roll moar AP”, all I have to say is fuck off, I have them all, and still dont want to re-roll them every week, but to play the class I enjoy playing (op, merc, sniper, jugg in my case)

Yeah, cos Sin Hatred self healing and dps wasn’t nerfed to ground, taken from half-mid ranged to full melee. Think about PVE as well, not just PVP. Anyway, yeah, I’m also annoyed by the constant nerfs, but this patch might turn out the better way around.

Fact is they’re changing things that don’t even need fixed and gimping gimped professions even more you can call it qq all you want just stating the facts.

wow… again ridiculously boosting sorc and nerfing bh, why? bunch of idiots. Stop fucking up with classes all the time.

Whatever you say pal….. bet your BH won’t stand a chance against a sniper, BH defenses don’t stand a chance. You will get rooted and mowed down like grass, FACT! I’ve been playing BH since day one of game and PVP everyday.

leave the noble sacrefice and consumption alone. dont take the unique thing from sages and sorcs away….

and now there is absolutly no point of using medical probe. it was a shitty heal/cost anyway. and now it heals even less. they should have at least reduce the cost or make defensive stacks last longer or something.

What? So they lowered the healing “slightly” on Kolto Probe and Nanotech, but you get 2% more base healing overall, and another 2% for 6 seconds after using your TA. They lowered the HoT on Infusion, but increased it’s upfront healing…so it probably averages out to be the same. Diagnostic Scan’s healing is lower…but you don’t use that as a heal so much as a way to get energy back, so that’s negligible.

To make up for it you’re getting your main big heal “significantly” increased, you’re able to channel Diagnostic Scan while moving so you can still regen energy even when you have to get out of fire, and they’re giving you a new 6 piece bonus that’s actually worth a damn.

I’d say operatives got buffed pretty good, all things considered.

Agreed. We won’t know for sure until the PTS is up, but a significant buff to Kolto Injection solves one of the major weak spots for operatives. The extra 2% on all heals received also makes Operatives more desirable as one of your raid healers.

The Defuser timer in Voidstar has been increased to 6 seconds.

Defusing is rare. Why make it even harder? The Devs really should play the game once before changing something like that.

My guess is that the new rules for aoe not stopping capping objectives goes for the defusing as well.

Defusing would be way too simple with AoE no longer interrupting, it’s only a 3 sec cast after all.

I love how they never put the actual numbers up (what does ‘slightly’ mean?). Might as well reduce the patch notes to “Buffed stuff, nerfed other stuff” and just save everyone’s time.

*sigh* Well, as a BH Healer, it was nice to be in the sun for a couple of months. Back to nerf basement for the next three years.

Rapid scan loses an unspecificed amount of base healing, but gains 10% crit chance and a 5% increase to heals. I guessing this will end up being a net slight increase on an ability which has an awful heal vs energy ratio. Yay :/

Healing scan gains an unspecified amount of base healing, but loses 10% crit and suffers a whopping hit with the loss of decreased cooldown. Maybe a 20% total loss in sustained healing from this ability? On the plus side, we’ve got a gap in our rotation now. Guess we can squeeze in another Med shot (nerfed) or a Rapid Scan…Yay :/

I assume Progressive Scan will be the next hit as it’s now the only remaining lynch pin of the tree. Or maybe we’ll end up without a combat rez again (although, as you only need one in a raid group, it’s probably not a big enough nerf).

On the DPS PVP front, I guess they didn’t want BHs to be able to heal themselves in the unlikely event they survived the initial burst. Instead, with no escape, no anti-focus and only two, long cool down defensives I guess all we’ve got is ‘kite’ which puts us on the same tactical plain as a level 1 toon for defensive abilities. Yay. Still, with Merc/Mandos dominating ranked PVP, they had to do something, right? What’s that? We’re barely viable in ranked? Oh…

On the plus side, SORC BUFFS! After three years of near constant Sorc buffs, who saw that coming?

Where in hell do you get that this is a sorc buff?! Because I’m gonna take a wild guess and say you don’t actually play that class?

Up until this point, Sorcs haven’t had energy management problems on a par with the other classes. Now they will, but in return, they get buffs across their healing to balance it so sustained should stay the same.

But they do get a straight up buff to burst healing. This, on top of the just buffed bubbles…

It’s the opposite to what they are doing with the Merc/Mando. For them, sustained get’s a big hit but burst remains the same.

I can understand why Bioware does it. Sorcs/Sages are the most popular class and you need to keep your paying public happy. It’s just good economic sense.

I understand what you’re trying to say but here’s another thing about that. Sorcs had easy force management you’re right. But sorcs also have only one ability to regen force. Mercs and Ops have more and they have free heals. Mercs have 3 of sorts. Now, if you look at the Parsley leaderboard you’ll see something. Sorcs have least EHPS, and HPS. You’d think less HPS would be because of less burst, but that’s really not the case. The way sorcs play out and the way their skills are makes it so our heals are less precise. That’s ok. But that also means we get less EHPS. We waste more. We get some control over it but not always. Now, with added cost to every heal skill, we are always negative on force. We’re fighting to catch up. And making our ONLY way to regen force a casted ability of 2 seconds, or 1.5 with 2 stacks of Force surge (or instant if you want less force) makes it extremely problematic. Also, it doesn’t even say it’s uninterruptable… if it is interruptable, then honestly, sorcs are useless.
Burst doesn’t solve anything. Our burst was just fine. If force management is an issue that needs to be addressed, many good sorc players have given some awesome advices that actually make sense.

And lastly, let’s say a sorc dies. And is rezzed. What happens? We’re already low on health, low on force. How are we going to regenerate force in such a situation? Run and cast 2 second skill (which may be interruptable), to get 30 force (every single skill now costs more than 45) then cast Innervate to get stacks? And then again, run for 1.5 sec to get 50 force back? Or use all 3 stacks for 40 force (Dark infusion costs 45)

Honestly this is a nerf. It’s not a buff and just because people think they’ll heal for more doesn’t mean they’ll actually do it. Our burst heals are useless if we run around constantly trying to regen force. Overall heals will go down.

dude sorc has bubble… and can get back to full health easily without interrupts… and with a bubble absorbing damage… pretty much they get 2 lives…

You raise some good points. I think it’ll be a case of ‘wait and see what the actual numbers are’ on the PTS then live (for all classes).

One thing though, does Parsely only show HPS/EHPS? Or does it also combine damage absorbed into those numbers? I ask because I’m not sure the healer’s log show what a barrier put on the tank absorbs. If that’s the case, then the parsely figures are not counting one of the Sorcs stand out abilities in their numbers.

Yea Parsely does indeed show those things as well. But remember even bubble costs some force. And after testing sorcs in actual fights on PTS today I can tell you that we’re force negative after first 3 min. So even then, bubbles aren’t gonna be used liberally when we’re so low on force.

Sorcs/Sages are not the most popular class. The most popular class is the ever actual fotm class – which differs from patch to patch (e.g. it’s commando/bh right now).

Than again you seem to have absolutely no idea, nor have you read the recent or the last pts patch notes properly.

Sorc/Sage update is almost 1:1 as they throw it in our faces the last time they patched the pts. After only 2 days everyone agreed that the Sorc/Sage healer would not be viable like this; instead this class would simply vanish from HC content.

The only thing they changed is the name of our force regen skill plus they gave us a 4 set bonus that works with the “new” skill, since the old one got deleted.

It’s ridiculous that commando/bh players whine about this. It really is ridiculous. ;D

Do you have the class/pop metrics to back up your assertion? I believe the available data backs up mine.

As to reading patch notes, I’d swear they mentioned something about increasing the heal amount of several heals? Didn’t they? Hmm, maybe you are right. It’s maybe just the set bonus that they’re changing.

Assuming they did, I think more heal per GCD = more burst. The greater force cost balances that over a sustained period of time, but not over burst. Unless you are saying that a heal that costs 15 force and heals for 3,000 HP per GCD is a more effective burst heal than one that costs 25 force and heals for 5,000 per GCD? I guess you are, as you pointed out that I have no idea and that was my reasoning. Wow, I really don’t get this healing thing. Could you run me through the maths that says that more heal per GCD isn’t a buff to burst? Perhaps you could show me which of those two heals, if spammed, would do more healing over, say, a 4 GCD burst? I mean, you say they would be exactly the same, but I just can’t get the numbers to add up. One seem to do about 20,000 in that time, and the other only 12,000.

Honestly, I’m fine with them buffing Sages (have to be, given their history over the last 3.5 years), but it’s amusing that one class, that’s been consistently effective in PVE and PVP throughout the whole lifetime of SWTOR, gets buffed most patches where as another, that’s not been viable in competitive PVP since…1.2? Earlier? and was rarely included in top end raid groups is finally competitive with their peers (in PVE only) and, as a result, gets hit with the nerf hammer.

You don’t have the numbers. So why do you actually argue?
Don’t be pissed only because sb doesn’t agree to your silly whining. stfu 🙂

I knew it! I knew it! Here it comes – they will nerf the only class I still enjoyed playing, the merc healer. :-(((( They already forced me to stop playing the others when 3.0 came out or shortly afterwards. I guess July 21 will be the end of the road for me in this game… 🙁 Too bad, i really liked it.

When will a SINGLE-PLAYER Star Wars game come out?? I am really fed up with the publishers of the MMOs continuously screwing up their game for me… I want a game that I buy, own, and it doesn’t change.

Says the guy crying about non existent nerfs and moaning that there’s ONLY HUNDREDS of Star Wars single player games out. Oh and I can’t leave out, complaining that MMOs change over time.

Why are you waiting till July 21st to quit? You plan on quitting so you may as well quit now. Dethis and I will rock, paper, scissors, lizard, Spock for your stuff.

As I said, I really liked the game and plan to play the little part I still enjoy from it till the very last minute. When I read how 3.0 was going to nerf everything, I played very actively will all my toons till the very day 3.0 was introduced.

why do you have to quit the game because of some nerfs? to me IMO it just sounds like you only want to play classes that maybe be a little overpowered. but when they are brought down to earth with all the other classes then you decide you’re going to quit? it just sounds like that is all im saying.

I play a game in order to enjoy myself. When most of the classes I enjoyed playing were nerfed beyond recognition, I continued playing only the class I still enjoyed. Now they are going to nerf that too. With no enjoyable class left, what is the point of playing?

Well mate, still an MMO (and looks old as hell xD), but for a RPG with real depth you could try out Star Wars Galaxies (yep, that game has been rezzed with Bloodfin and some other emulators). Classes are as-is and not subject to constant retarded changes due to, you know: “Mommy Dev, getting my ass spanked in the arenas by “X” class everytime I try. Pls nerf em or get me a buahmbulance!”. People playing there realises it’s just a game and crying shall be reserved only for “got my cock bit by an alligator”-like situations.

Sadly, in order to play it on the emulators, you have to have the game in the first place – and it is my understanding that there is no legal way of obtaining it any more. Besides, I’ve seen a few videos of it on YouTube and really wasn’t impressed.

I liked SWtOR before Eaware screwed it up. If you don’t like what I write about it, feel free not to read it, fanboi.

im not a fanboy/girl or whatever, i like the game because of the star wars content, if you dont like it why you keep going in swtor sites? what a dumbass

Like which ones? I liked KotOR (both 1 and 2), but they no longer work on my machine; besides they are old. Jedi Academy and its precursors were also good but they are very, very old by now and of all of them only Jedi Academy still works on my machine. Galactic Battlegrounds was great – this is the Star Wars game I’ve played the most (more than 7 years), with tons of user-created levels – but it, too, is old and no longer works here. Empire at War sucked when compared to other RTS games, I didn’t even bother to finish it. The Force Unleashed I played exactly once. Not that I disliked it, it’s not a bad game – just not good enough to make me want to play it over and over again. Battlefront I didn’t like – somewhat to my surprise, because I like Star Wars games and FPS games and it was both. Flight simulators I don’t like, so I never played those (X-Wing, etc.). Ridiculous games like the LEGO series aren’t my cup of tea, either.

In any case, these are OLD games. Those of them that I did like, I’ve played many, many times. There hasn’t been any other decent Star Wars game besides SWtOR for years. 🙁

3.0 made classes actually better
sounds like you could only play hybrids
and no, they never forced you to stop, you are just a big whinie

Not that I support whining of any kind, but no it didn’t. Most classes have been screwed since 3.0.

No, I didn’t play hybrids. Most of my toons were pure healers, one was a dps (mara). You are only demonstrating your ignorance.

What’s wrong with the other healers? Sages are strong as ever, maybe stronger (though this patch might be a nerf)

In 3.0 the dps of the healers was nerfed into oblivion. Only the merc healer was still viable. It’s the only one I could still do the Gree event with (at level 55).

Before 3.0, I could solo every single kingpin during bounty week with each one of my healers. After 3.0 I could do it only with my merc healer – and he still dies a lot. The sage healer can do about half of them, but not the ones on Alderaan, Tatooine and Coruscant. The scoundrel healer can’t do even the easiest one – on Hutta. (This is a good illustration, because the mob scales with your level, so you can’t really outlevel it; it’s only up to your gear, abilities and skill. My gear and skill didn’t change when 3.0 hit.)

everyone’s dps got nerfed a lot in 3.0, iirc they told us to expect our old dps number around lvl 60 (so obviously lvl 55 is lower)
tbh I haven’t had any trouble doing the bounties on my sage healer, actually find it easier than as a dps (there is no way you should die if you’re any good)
killing might be a bit slower than when you just spam disturbance, but that’s to be expected..
I don’t remember for sure, but I don’t think they actually nerfed any attacks, just the global numbers for the sage, so unless you used hybrid, your dps at lvl 60 should still be fine (as it is in my experience)
scoundrel is a bit harder to dps with (for me at least), but I’ve never felt that the mando is much stronger

having said that, why whine about a healer’s dmg? it’s _supposed_ to be crap, because you heal.. in any group content there is little to no reason (apart from easy content) to do dps, so the only place where dps matters for a healer is when soloing, which is where you either take a dps companion to help a little, or respec to dps (with a healing comp if you die a lot)

Awesome! More nerfs, finally! That was utterly needed! We are close to achieve our final goal: soon all classes will be forced to wear no armors nor weapons at all, and then, only then, when nude fists do the talking, we gonna be satisifed. Until then, BRING MA MOAR NERFS! ME GOT DA HUNGER!

Yep healer changes are kinda simplification as Force / Ammo / Energy whatever spent is increased, but healing increased as well. Sooo whatta.. 😮 I wonder when Eaware stops this uber simplification / dumping down. It’s been going very strong since 3.0 landed and it started already with less visible changes @ 1.5’ish :/

How is this patch dumbing anything down? The 2 kolto probes to 1 kolto probe, that’s a clear dumbing down, but luckily it didn’t go through

It’s dumb because they are launching a nerf-strike on several classes with no apparent reason at all. Yes, it is a nerf. For sure, we are getting (talking about Sorcs/Sages now) easy resource management now, but notice that almost all our heals are channeled, that we “waste” usually more resources per fully used healing and that ALL of our abilities cost resources. So now we get this patch that makes ALL our healing abilities cost EVEN MORE and a straight nerf to our force-regen ability. Our least consuming ability costs us now 45, and our regen only grants us 40, so we always stay negative. Just imagine a sorc being killed in an op, rezzing him would be a waste since he starts with no health and no force at all, and now with nerfed force-regen ability and increased costs we cannot compete against any other class. Thank God we got some spare bits, YAY INCREASED HEALZ X(

Now the merc part… well, I take it is not necessary for me to point out how this class will remain abandoned by all the ones playing it now till, dunno, someone at the PvP forums starts bitchin’ about “ye cannot keel anything with ma merc, pls buff or nerf others (and that last one will be the most “reasonable” outcome for BW xD).

Don’t take me wrong, I’m not attacking the PvP community, I both do PvE and PvP, but we must assume those idiotic changes to classes always come required from some part of the PvP community whos not good at playing the game and, instead of just accepting it and have fun the way the can/must, they just bitch around blaming the keyboard, the computer, the lag, the hax and the OMFGLMAO UNBALANCED CLASSES… Since BW cannot do anything about their keyboards and cmputers, they just pull out the hammer and kill classes in a cyclic nerfing mayhem.

Due to this changes, I would personally return to my Jugg tank and dps, but seeing pvp servers/games are CROWDED with em I can expect a future nerf incoming (due to “hey, so much jugg, they are OP then”-logic), so I’m sticking with ma healers and adapting to changes like I always did. Just to point out, instead of forcing us to replay the already published content EVERY FUCKING TIME they decide to change things in such an stupid way to get used to the classes, they could just, you know, make new content? Aside from CM shit ofc, that is being released every single week. Also, I’m starting to grow really tired having to re-adapt to everything every nerf cycle. And I’m not the only one: tons of ppl are starting to grow tired over this, and they will end up killing their player base… Holly Shit of Antioch, It’s like having to switch the crop-fields every time the Nile overflows!

Raising cost and amount done does not simplify things. If you remove alot of abilities like WoW did, that would be uber simplification.

I still think the sage/sorc changes are unnecessary, but this is better than what they posted before thanks to resplendence and the set bonus stuff. We’ll see how it plays out. I’m rarely optimistic when BW balances anything.

I just laugh at the irony of my own playing experience.

A couple months ago I thought to myself “you know..I’m gonna play my Assassin that’s been at level 50 since game launch” and then literally an hour later I saw patch notes that it was getting changes

Then yesterday before the patc notes came out I was like “you know..I tried Operative healing and liked it so much, let’s try Merc and Sorc healing” and then I read the patch notes and it’s literally changes to nothing but healer classes xD

But Sorc is getting a healing buff, did you want to play a weaker class? BTW, sorc healers don’t even need a buff.

It’s not a buff. Even though the heals get stronger the cost of your heal skills goes up dramatically and your energy management gets nerfed at the same time.

I love how they are focusing on “re-balancing” classes that don’t need adjusted, instead of adding more content to the game to keep people playing. The big summer update is Ziost? Seriously? Took me like 2 hours to beat that planet with all my characters and haven’t been back since. The Ziost vendor items are crap and there is no rep… why even bother grinding the dailies? It’s like a crappy version of Oricon. Oh well, I’m sure that yavin stronghold that no one can buy b/c they didn’t increase the stronghold limit will surely keep people playing this game… right?…. lol.

You can still buy the Yavin Stronghold, it’s that you just can’t have more than 4 active at one time. You have to decide which 4 you want active at any single time.

Why would I pay for something I cannot enjoy because there is a -on the other hand, quite stupid- limit? And why would I pay AGAIN to unlock this new thing and LOCK BACK my previously purchased stuff?

I would wait for the news on the 15th. Who knows what that’ll bring, but yeh, Ziost, although I like the planet as such has absolutely no replay value for me. I just go there with the guild for the bosses once a week. Don’t even go with pugs on my alts there. Can’t be bothered…not to mention not having a quick travel option to go there…

Note to self: Don’t play sage healer. Maybe play scoundrel healer. Play commando healer.
eff it all, I’ll just tank and put up with my healers complaining. Prepare to get muted.

If the higher cost doesn’t have a drastic affect, then it is a huge buff. The only way it could be a nerf is if the sage is constantly empty. I’m not sure how sage healer compares to the others in pve but in pvp they are OP, if geared and played correctly, obviously. The bad sages are easily killed though, so they probably want to buff them……

You’ll probably not end up empty all the time, but using the new consumption every now and again and watching your force will probably become necesarry. Welcome to the world of mercs and operatives I guess ;p

“Welcome to the world of mercs and operatives”

No thank you, having one of each healer should feel different logging from one to the other. Making sages the same is….well stupid.

Not my point, I meant that sorcs will actually have to worry about their force pool now. But energy management will still be very different from operatives and mercs, who have one big energy cooldown.

Let’s look at the merc. The merc has a big energy cooldown + a heal at zero cost + 10 stacks that can be used to regain energy. In effect a merc has 3 ways of regaining energy. The sorc in the new set up will get one which has a 2 second cast and regains just enough energy to cast one heal. I am not sure why this is great, but what it means it will be something that has to be part of the standard rotation without the possibility for a quick recovery, you know when someone screws up or you got ressed with about zero energy. The problem with having it as part of the regular rotation is that it brings down your possibilities to burst heal, which is needed with spike damage. Oh but the heals are stronger now…true but at a force cost increase of 20-50% it’s gonna be interesting to see how and if that balances out.

Well it entirely depends, can a sorc heal relatively light damage without using the new consumption? If so, this might be a boost actually, since the healing from pretty much everything is increased, they wanted to give sorcs a big energy burst, but people don’t seem to want it, I guess we’ll have to wait and see.

Well, they say “significantly increased” and don’t give us actual numbers. It could mean anything.

True enough, until we can actually test the changes this is all mainly speculation, but ‘significantly increased’ does suggest a noticable increase.

I’m honestly curious to see if you’ve actually tested any of the new changes on sorcs on PST in actual flashpoints and ops. Because if so, you’d see that sorcs are running force negative constantly. The cost is too great for what we’re getting back in force regen. Plus, overall healing is down because of cast time to con. darkness being a 1.5 seconds cast. And having to use it so much.

As I said, until I can test the changes (which indicates I have not yet tested), I can only speculate on the subject. I do look forward to see the changes for myself in practise but haven’t been able to yet

Since the PTS is down (was suppose to be up yesterday) I’m curious to see what how they changed it from the last PST. Last PTS changes were horrible and yea force management was beyond ridiculous. From what I’ve read as of now, the only difference is that now you can move while casting con. darkness. And the redesign of 4pc. bonus to give you +10 force which… yea.

On the last pts it restored 15 force with a 1.5 seconds cast, +5 force per stack of force surge. That is terrible to say the least

Now we get a baseline of 30 force, plus 15 on set bonus, plus 5 per stack of force surge. We do get a 2 seconds cast, however, force surge reduces it with 0.25 per stack (2 stacks will be exatly 1 gcd) and the third stacks removes it entirely, plus doing it while moving is a nice boost. It is at the very least significantly better than last PTS

You might want to reread that again.

“Consumption has been redesigned and renamed Consuming Darkness: Consuming Darkness restores 30 Force and heals a friendly target. The cooldown has been removed and a 2 second activation time has been added. All Sorcerers will need to visit their class trainer to attain Consuming Darkness.”

k, that’s base line 30. But then….

“The Consumption effect of Force Surge has been removed and redesigned with Consuming Darkness: Consuming Darkness restores 5 additional Force and reduces activation time by 0.25 seconds for each of the first two Force Surge charges, OR makes it activate instantly with the third charge. Consumes all charges.”
That means, if you have 2 stacks of Force surge and you use Con. Darkness you get +5 for 1 and +5 for 2nd one = +10 while reducing activation time by .5 seconds (total cast time 1.5 seconds)
IF you however use it with 3 stacks “OR makes it activate instantly with the third charge. Consumes all charges.” you don’t get +10. Just the baseline 30 with an instant cast.

“The Force-Mystic’s 4-piece set bonus has been redesigned: Consuming Darkness or Vindicate restore an additional 10 Force.”
That means you get +10.

So in reality you don’t get +15 on 4pc. bonus, you get +10. AND only +10 on first two stacks ( 3rd one makes it instant but you sacrifice +10. Remember

“5 additional Force and reduces activation time by 0.25 seconds for each of the first two Force Surge charges, OR makes it activate instantly with the third charge. Consumes all charges.”

So with 2 stacks total is +50. With 3 stacks for instant cast it’s only +40

I’m pretty sure they add the force boost from force surge even on 3 stacks, otherwise 2 stacks would be better than 3 since in both cases you’re spending 1 gcd. But it is quite awkwardly phrased.

That’s why we need PTS to figure that out. But if we get to keep +10 and activate it instantly, then what is the point of lowering the cast time by .25 seconds for first two stacks?

Well, with 1.5 seconds you have exactly 1 gcd, any low. But yeh, bring us PTS!! I want to test things.

I’m thinking they’re making you use the con. darkness with 2 stacks because it’s more beneficial than with 3. With 3 it’s a “oh shit i need what I can get”. So, I don’t think they’ll let you keep the +10 on 3 stacks. But we’ll see I guess today

I think the part “for each of the first two force surge charges ” refers only to the activation time reduction, not the extra force generated, cuz even with 3 stacks, it’s still on the gcd, meaning you still have to wait those 1,5 seconds before you can actually use the force you regained.

If that’s the case then you get +5 in total instead and that sucks even more.

Wouldn’t it be +15? Because you have 3 stacks which all give +5? Either way, there is no real way of knowing other than testing on PTS I guess, so when it finally launches I’ll be back to bother you more ;p

I can tell you that at least in last pts version, it was a nerf (had to use noble sacrifice a LOT)
But I’ll test it once it’s live..
In pvp it will make it hard, it can already be hard to keep force up in long fights (using stacks on instant salvation instead of force), but sages are stable healers, scoundrels can get way higher healing, but that’s rare.
In pve sage are said to be weaker than the others, but I’ve never had any trouble myself (soloing sm ops, and duo on hm), same story, sages are stable, the others have potentially higher healing (badlygeared scoundrels can get 8k hps just from slow release medpack :p)

Tldr, that’s a big if you just named

Not impressed with the operative and scoundrel healing Nerfs, they weren’t doing so much healing anyway.

All this sht happens because of the damn Pvp wzns once again.
They don’t give a sht if people cant heal their groups properly even in the sm operations not to mention HM Monolith’s sht hits the fun moment.

It doesn’t look like their healing is being nerfed. Where are you getting the idea that they are being nerfed? It looks they are just adjusting their healing. Lowering it in some areas while raising it in others. And decreasing the amount of healing while also decreasing the cost isn’t necessarily a nerf.

Can you read? They are not decreasing the cost. They are increasing the cost. And even if they say the are increasing the the heal the increase in cost will not compensate for it. Every time Bioware does this it screws over the healers because PVP players can’t stop complaining on how they can’t kill a healer. Well dud they are a healer. They are supposed to be difficult to kill because they have no DPS. PVP players need to get the hell out of this game and go back to whatever they were playing before.

Can you read through? “.. the operative and scoundrel healing nerfs..” That is what who you’re responding to was talking about. Nowhere have they increased the cost for operative heals. Also, pvp is also part of the game, deal with it.

PVP is a freaking joke in this game. It is the biggest reason why this game loses players on a monthly basis. It needs to be removed. If people want to PVP go play on a damn PVP server and fight players there.

“It is the biggest reason why people leave this game on a monthly basis. ”
Oh really, do you have anything to back that up, or do you just like complaining? I’d wager senseless nerfs and buffs is a much bigger factor.
PvP is not going away, people enjoy it, people pay for it, BioWare won’t shoot itself in the foot like that.

Look at the numbers. NEVER has the game gained players by changing or adding PVP content. The ONLY time this game gains members is when they release PVE content. It does not take a genius to figure it out. You PVP players just can’t take the hint. The largest servers they have are PVE servers. When PVP servers die off PVP players move to PVE servers because they have more people. They then destroy the PVE server because they whine and complain about everything not being PVP oriented. Well no freaking duh, its a PVE server. Just accept the fact that a small group of players like you suck and are ruining the game for the majority of players.

Just because a small part of the PvPers cry for nerfs when they lose, doesn’t mean every PvPer is like that. Also, I’m pretty sure no one moves to a PvE server and complains about there not being enough PvP. And it’s shortsighted to think just because the game doesn’t gain subscribers by adding PvP content, they won’t lose subscribers when they remove it.

What a load of crap. Everyday I log onto mt server there are PVP players crying out in general chat. ” Just transferred here from another server and looking for an active PVP guild.” Happens at least once a day without fail. You need to get your facts straight dude.

That is hardly ‘destroying the game by whining and complaining that it is not pvp oriented’. That is simply looking for players with similar interests, nothing wrong with that.


Did you know it’s possible to enjoy PvE and PvP? Furtheremore, there is nothing inherently wrong aobut PvPing on a PvE serve, one might not find as many people interested in PvP in a PvE server sure.
Is it smart to play on a PvE server if you want to PvP? No.
Is it a bad thing to do? No.
If these things bother you so much, I feel sorry for you.

It does bother me. My class is getting screwed with because PVPers can’t stop whining about how terrible PVP is. You don’t see PVE players going to a PVP server complaining about how terrible PVE is. It’s a freaking joke on how Bioware appeases the few at the expense of the many. Its a damn shame and if this wasn’t a Star Wars game based in my favorite time period of the Star Wars universe then I would have left years ago because they way this game is managed is complete and total crap.

I truly hope that on June 15 that they are announcing their final expansion to the game that way I can finish the story lines on all the characters and leave the game, and leave it to the PVP players who destroyed it.

If your class gets screwed because of PvP I get that it bothers you, I get that it friggin sucks. However these sorc changes are based on the fact that sorc force pool is insane, a nerf for that was very much to be expected, you can just spam around your heals without ever worrying about your force depleting. Now they’re changing that, I don’t see why they want to increase costs AND redesign consumption. Either one would seem good enough for me, either way I reserve judgement about sorc changes until I test them out on PTS.

And why is it such a problem with the healing pool the way it is? Oh that’s right because PVP players don’t like that the “force pool is insane” So there. You just openly admitted that it is being changed because PVP players do not like how big it is.There is no PVE player of any spec or class that would complain about how big a pool is. You are such a hypocrite. I hope people are reading this so they can see what a liar you are.

No, if you have such a big pool, you have an unfair advantage over other healers. This also counts for PvE, and nerfing the energy pool, is that really so bad if your energy pool is that good as sorc. If it completely messes up sorc healing, then I agree it’s a terrible nerf and should never come to live, if it does not, it has the potential of making the sorc healer better, if sensibly played.

There are no such things as advantages in PVE. Every player that plays PVE wants their healers to be buffed because they stay alive. You are making a terrible case for yourself as a PVP player. Still not convincing anyone with your ideas. Not a single one of your points has any merit.

Of course there is such a thing as advantages in PvE, if one class would do insane damage for instance, it has a clear edge over other classes, making people want mainly this class in their operation teams, making it harder to join an operation team as another class. The nerf was to force management was to be expected, I’m just hoping it’s not entirely wrecked into the ground.

Once again you are wrong. It is quite obvious that you are not a raider. The way that he spec is set up now is the only reason people want sorcs to begin with. Once this nerf is implemented no one will want a sorc in their team because they will be unable to keep up with heals because there pool will be drained. So your point is yet again has no merit. And once again you are only proving to everyone that you are clearly a DPS PVP player that wants to nerf the hell out of healers.

I have no dps character geared for PvP ranked actually. I have my sorc tank and operative healer for PvP. In operations I generally heal on my operative, the easier ones I sometimes do on my sorc, because I’d like some gear there too. I also tank fairly often on my jugg and I have a spare dps set there too.

Hey genius there is no such thing as a sorc tank. Wow do even know what a sorc is?

I blame the patchnotes being all about the healer classes. My apologies, I meant to write jugg but my head was thinking about what i was going to write, that happens to me sometimes >.<

So with that being said you honestly have no idea how a sorc healer really works because you do not play it enough to understand how it works. All your narrow mind can comprehend is that “hey there is a sorc healer in this wz and he won’t die, lets nerf him.” You really are the stereotype PVP player that talks out of their ass and has no idea what they are talking about.

Again with the assumptions, I play it ofter enough in ops to know which heals to use at which time, to know how force and consumption work. To know that revivication is kinda meh at the moment already and that I dislike the increase in cost it gets.

You still do not play it enough in HM content to know how terrible this is. And even if you did there is no way you would be defending this patch the way you have been with EVERY SINGLE ONE of you posts. And all of your other posts have been all about PVP and how this is only going to benefit those few players that actually PVP. You are and always will be a joke in the SWTOR community.

I have been defending it because I think the hate it is recieving currently is kind of unreasonable, considering PTS is down and there has been no chance whatsoever to test these changes a bit. Not because I think it’s generally a good boost, I just don’t know yet. I guess you could do the maths to figure out exactly how your force regen will look, but that still ignores that pretty much every single heal has been increased by an unspecified amount.

just remember folks, this is going onto the PTS obviously things will change, who knows maybe a lot of these patch notes wont even make it past PTS, only time will tell. all they are doing right now is testing these changes and more than likely changes WILL happen.

Indeed. Sent’s Watchman now completely buggered into pieces.. Really no idea why Eaware keeps on giving love to only certain classes most of the time and then smashing down certain ones so often. Like Mara & Sent have been getting lots of negative hits.. :/ Think of going b to Concentration “Focus before rename” as loved it from 1 to 50 before changed to Watchman.

One of my friends who is one of the best sentinels on Jedi Covenant now does more damage in Watchman with the changes. It’s just as much about the player.

Mara and sent? have you read the patch notes where sents have damage bugs fixed that dont exist for mara. sents get repeatedly shafted, mara doesnt

I don’t really understand the whole “i’m glad sages are getting burst heal increase”

I have ZERO issues getting a tank up with my sage. I average 4k ehps per boss in hard mode. I’m actually mad at myself if I dont do above 4k ehps.

I am also a very good scoundrel heals. Many scoundrel healers say the class is not bursty. Again what’s with this burst obsession? If your tanks are melting it’s because they are not using their cooldowns effectively and/or standing in stupid.

All tank guides have something in common. They all say “use cooldowns expecting big damage, not when you are at 30% HP”

That is spot on! If you heal right and know a fight well enough that you know when the big spike damage comes, then you dont need burst heals. You need healers that know when and how to heal.

An aspect of the game seems to be a vocal minority inconveniencing an already satisfied majority. Kind of tired of “dealing with it” over and over again. When is it pvp’s turn to “deal with it”?

Are these changes mainly pvp inspired? Hardly, and while I agree that the whining from pvp players is very annoying, it hardly means that every pvper is a crybaby. Pvp is also a part of the game and should be taken into account when balancing. Now if pve is ignored because of pvp that is a very bad thing, but that doesn’t mean that pvp balance is irrelevant.

Pvp victim complex. Didn’t blame all pvpers, I said a vocal minority. With my words. Readily available for reading. To answer your question though (even though you felt the need to answer it yourself, albeit wrong) yes it is “mainly” pvp inspired…you pretty much said that yourself, then contradicted it.
“Burst heal is sometimes invaluable in pve, but plays an even greater role in ranked pvp”
“Are these changes mainly pvp inspired? Hardly…” Wut?

I am sure there are pve players excited that their sorc or sage healer is finally going to be more like the other two classes, but for the most part, I don’t think we want to all be the same.

If a class undergoes any changes, first and foremost, it should be exciting. It should enrich the experience of the player. I don’t feel enriched. I feel like they are taking something I am doing just fine with, and replacing it with something I don’t care for. I don’t subscribe to the WoW mentality that a class needs to have an overhaul every couple of months and be relearned. Tweaks are fine, reworking nearly every ability in someone’s toolbox is not.

Was healing spectacularly in ranked, in hm, sm, and solo content. Didn’t need any fixes. If the changes were necessary and logical, I’d have no complaint, I have a pretty decent track record for that.

While I said burst is invaluable in ranked, it does not mean it’s mainly pvp inspired. Burst definitely has it’s place in operations as well, with big burst of damage being quite common, why do you think B mods are gaining popularity amongst tanks? Because dtps hardly kills a tank, a big burst does and the way to counter a big burst as a healer is a big burst heal.

While it is indeed partially based on PvP I think PvE may actually benefit, if force management is not entirely nerfed into the ground, we’ll have to see PTS for that. And there is hardly any major reworking in this patch really, except consumption but that is one ability and something had to happen to sorc force management, it was inevitable.

So you quoted me…then said what I said…that you quoted…isnt what I said, by editing your own spin into it afterwards? I said exactly what I said. I didn’t secretly say something else that your super brain decoded. O.O

Ah well, I did misread, I tought you said: An aspect of the game that seems to be etc. i.e. calling the entirety of ranked an inconveniencing minority.
Upon rereading is saw you didn’t actually say that, you said that the vocal minority inconveniencing an already satisfied majority is an aspect of the game. I misread that, my bad

See not a single person agrees with you on any point you make. You are truly a one man band with a terrible song that no one wants to hear.

Invaluable in a sense that we already have it? In that case sure. No need to change much of anything.

Agreed. People will stand in stupid, and you need burst. The issue comes in when your burst is “too bursty”. And when every single ability is now healing for more, the chances of lowering your ehps is greater. And as sorcs we have less control on that then other two classes.

Pherhaps, my main healer is my operative and I’d argue oppers are pretty close with overheal danger, with all the hots. Not that I can really complain, I like where the operative is at right now and the changes on operative actually seem good to me.

Let’s be real, despite how “You” feel
Getting a nice 30k+ from two GCDs with a Mando/Merc is pretty damn sexy.

Sages/Sorc Op/Scoundrel can’t do that

if your doing more it simply means everyonme in ur group is standing in stupid
its simple. the higher ehps means ppl standingf in dumb., if no one taking damage lw ehps. 4k is just fine

Seriously Most of you have not done HM AT ALL if you think you need over 4k effective heals EVERY fight. On Revan HM, I guarantee you have probably not even touched him, when all of us do as we are supposed too and use sonic rebounder for heaves our healers barely break 4k effective. None of us die and we kill him just fine. If you are ignorant then please do not post something because you just look stupid.

on my mando, i do around 5-6k ehps on revan and cora fight. (i dont remember exact numbers, as long as every1 lives, np) in some messy attempts it goes up to 7k-ish. so i know my shit. for the rest, if you do 4k something it should be ok, if your grp knows what to do and avoid shit on the ground. in that case you can contribute a little as dps. it doesnt hurt to kill bosses earlier 🙂

Or maybe my team is really good at NOT standing in stupid or getting tunnel vision or using proper cooldowns at the right times? I feel bad for you having to work so hard to heal because your team loves to eat red in the face

Is it confirmed that the Ranked = Unranked PvP WZ comm conversion will be a 1:1 ratio? If so, I guess there’s no point in me holding onto my Ranked comms at this moment then.

Mainly wondering because I’ve been sitting on a few Ranked comm and the “official” post from SWTOR didn’t say anything about the conversion.

And this is why I should stop being lazy and make an account so I can edit my own comments. 😛

Thanks again Bioware for only paying attention to PVP players. This is going to kill sorc heals and healers are hard enough to find to do raids and ops. I really hate how this game only appeases PVP players and screws everyone else.

Enough with the victim complex already, the game consists of both PvE and PvP, they are trying to balance the game around both, but if you just sit here wining instead of offering legit criticism, nothing is gonna change in your favour.

Is that all you do is antagonize people on these posts? Its no wonder you are a PVP player. You had to have been bullied as a child.

You are calling me out on antagonising while you’re demonising the entirety of the PvP community? Sorcs had too easy force management, I said it before and I’ll say it again, that was how it was. These changes might be overdoing it, I agree, but the general idea of making force management a bit more difficult seems to be a reasonable one. I’m interested to see how big the impact will be on force management, remember pretty much all sorc heals are getting boosts in healing power! If force is manageable, that can be a great thing got heavy healing phases.

Again you do not look at history. Bioware has done changes like this before and never has the “boost” been more beneficial than the nerf. All this “change” is suppose to do is make it easier for DPS to kill healers in PVP, which by in turn screws over the PVE community when trying to heal for ops. I guarantee you that sorcs will run out of force power and healing will be more challenging than ever. But its okay because PVP players can kill a healer faster. What a freaking joke.

This boost is not to make healers easier to kill in pvp, hell in ranked pvp with tanks and healers, healers rarely get focused, banging on a healer with a guard is just silly. And in ranked with healers and dps, well healers drop pretty darn fast anyways. These changes are here because the sorcerer has an almost unlimited pool of force as of right now, so boosting heald while increasing costs seems like a good way to 1) Make sorcs have to manage energy. 2) Increase their healing. Now I haven’t tested the changes yet to see how severe they are, if indeed energy management will become insane, then I agree it needs to change. But these changes are not to accommodate PvP, these changes are here because sorcs can use a healing boost and can take an energy pool nerf.

Again with another naive statement. My main character is a sorc heal and I have absolutely no need for a “healing boost.” The only reason Bioware is making this change is because DPS players want to be able to kill sorc healers. That is the only reason. You can pretend that it isn’t but facts are facts. The only reason Bioware ever changes anything with classes is because PVP players whine that a class is too hard to kill in a warzone and Bioware jumps to fix it rather than telling them to deal with it. I am sick of having my class changed because a PVP players whines on the forums. Just leave it alone and let the PVP players deal with their issue or leave the game. Its as simple as that.

Sorcs have incredibly easy force management as it stands, Bioware changes this, not necessarily a PvP thing I might add. Be glad they decide to give some extra healing power in return, they could have just increased the costs, now I can’t really see if they are overdoing it before testing these changes on PTS, but the idea of nerfing sorc energy is not new and not bound to PvP.

Keep on telling yourself that. There was absolutely nothing wrong with sorc heals. As I said I have been healing for a long time and there is nothing that I would have changed. You are placing way way way too much faith in this “boost.” NEVER has Bioware given a boost without a major set back. This change is completely unnecessary and if you believe it is not because of PVP then I guess you can keep your head in the sand

Also I have been able to read a lot of your other posts. Funny thing. Not a SINGLE person agrees with you on any of your views or opinions. Huh? I wonder why that is? Could it be that you continually talk out of your ass and have no idea what you are talking about? And that you are one of those PVP players that not a single persons cares for. You are truly the the disgrace of this once wonderful game and are the reason why so many people have left. I truly hope that you and your small PVP community enjoy playing a game that will only have about 50 players once Bioware has announced their final addition the the PVE gameplay.

What the hell is it with you? You’re the only one throwing accusations around, not using any logic other than your own twisted one and keep insulting people all around. Before you start out with your crap routine I do not play a lot of PvP, in fact I am a PvE progression player and have played Sage/Sorc healers on progression on HM/NiM content since 1.0 including the new HM Ops.

You talk about “proof” where there is none. You talk about “nerf” when in fact noone knows if this is in fact a nerf. The only thing we know is that the patch will trade energy management (which is ridiculously easy as it is now on live) against burst heals (which Sorc definitely lack with respect to the other healing classes).

The funny thing is that you actually do what you accuse the PvP crowd of. – whining –

Of course I am going to complain. If someone screws up my class because they get butt hurt in a WZ and light up the forums then yeah I am going to get pissed. And this isn’t a small nerf. This is a bug one. Every sorc healer will have to change their gear, their rotation, and their play style all because PVP players don’t like sorcs in a WZ. It is a giant load of crap

You’re like a broken record. Repeating yourself doesn’t make your claims any more credible, you know?
This is a MMO. Class changes happen all the time, get over it.

And dumb asses like you will be the reason why they continue to fail over and over again.

And your your mom still tucks you in at night and tells you how proud she is of you for staying home with her rather than moving out into the dangerous world.

You should not judge others by your own standards. You are really helpless in a discussion, ey?

Since when was this ever a discussion? This is a debate. A debate on whether or not PVP players get special treatment in this game that causes a majority of others to get screwed over. You are the one that had to come in and say comments that had absolutely nothing to do with the debate. Must have struck a nerve with the whole living with mommy bit. OOOOO sorry bud but if you do not like being called out on who and what you are keep your nose out of it.

If anything this is a debate about class changes and not about anything PVP’ers get or do not get. Think what you will. Your comprehension is obviously seriously impaired.
The only one you do actually impress with your nonsensical insults is yourself. So much so that you keep upvoting your own comments…

On a related note, I find it quite funny that you upvote your own posts. Alone I might add.

You’re right in saying that sorcs have easy energy management. But then again for sorcs every ability costs force. Every single one. Even bubble. And we only ever get one way to regen force. Mercs have a free heal and 3 skills to manage their heat. Ops have a free heal (that helps them actually regen energy) and a “oh shit” button to hit when they run low on energy.

So, while you’re right about one thing, you’re displaying complete unfamiliarity in how that class actually plays out in elder game content. In HM ops. What they’re doing is nonsensical, and unnecessary. If you look at the Parley leaderboard you’ll see what sorcs across the board have lowest Ehps and hps. But that’s not because we’re not getting enough “burst” to our heals. Sorcs have burts as of right now, and a good one. Our heals are just less precise. That’s just how it is. Adding more burst isn’t going to increase Ehps. Or heals overall. It just means more will be wasted. It also means overall we’ll heal less because we’ll have to spend far too much managing force.

Our AOE heal is gonna be unjustified in most cases due to high cost and about 10% of each initial force mend will be wasted because it’ll overheal. Our cheapest heal is 45 force. And our highest return (with 1.5 cast time) is 50. Every other heal costs 60 and up. Adding bigger boost to each heal makes no sense. There’s been so many excellent suggestions from people who actually main this class that boiled down to: increase the cost slightly, get cons. on gcd or do both. Simple solution that would have made sense. Most of these changes do not play out well in actual fights. Keep in mind that they didn’t say our cast of con. darkeness is uninterruptable? If that’s true, then there’s no point getting a sorc healer in a game that has so many stun, knockback mechanics.

Plus, I’d love to see you try to regen force if you die and get rezzed. I’ll bring popcorn and laugh at you while you run around for 2 seconds (at least) to get 40 (not 50) force back for a single heal that costs 45 (and is the cheapest).

Well, mercs and oppers may both have an o shit button, but try spamming kolto injection on your operative, you’ll have to use it in no time. Even without consumption, sorcs force is still mighty fine. As for the free heal on operative, the heals from it are barely noticable and the energy regen isn’t that much either. When it comes down to it, mercs and oppers have to manage their energy pool, sorcs don’t. Now I’m not saying theses changes are all good, but they might not be all that terrible, depending on how much your healing power will increase and how hard force management will be.

Well here’s the thing. These two classes have these options that sorcs simply don’t. Their free heal is free and regens force. You say it’s not the best but it’s still there. Mercs have colto shot and it’s not meant to be used as primary heal but again, it’s free and a good way to top off people while lowering your heat. These two classes actually HAVE options. They have more control over how they use their heals to prevent overhealing. Sure, sorcs have easy time with force management. But, these changes will make it so force management is extremely difficult. Way more that it’s logical and necessary. And increase in healing is about 9 – 19% on heals in general on the last PTS patch.

Healing with diagnostic scan is almost the same as doing nothing healing wise, you can probably pull the same using the new consuming darkness on cd, no? Yes you get a cast instead of a channel, but the energy pool regeneration is quite more significant

Con. darkness on last PTS. healed for 150 to 300… in total. So I’m gonna say probably not. Energy pool regeneration is 50 max. Over 1.5 seconds. And then you cast reviv. or 75… you’re – 25. You use inner. for 60 force to get 3 stacks (or 2) to get another 50 = -10…Cast force mend, which is 50… at this point you’re running on -30 or so force and constantly using con. darkness as is. SO, yea, it’s not more significant.

Okay, the healing of diagnostic scan is indeed better, but it only restores 2 force per crit with 3 ticks. That is meager at best.

Are you kidding? Force regen is ridiculously slower for a sorc compared to any other class. This system will fail and you will lose even more sorc heals. Which based on all your comments as a PVP player is what you want. So I guess you win in that regards. Why won’t you just admit you are happy with these nerfs because you benefit as a PVP player.

Why would I benefit as a PvP player? My healer will die more quickly, doesn’t seem like a pro to me. Remember, in pvp there are healers on either side if a heal class get completely nerfed, I won’t like it. I just want to add that while I have been defending PvP on these posts, I actually play operations fairly regular, thrice a week in an operations team. And believe me if me co-healer (sorc) loses significant healing I won’t be happy at all.

Even if that is true, which I doubt it is, be prepared to solo heal over half the fights because the sorc will have nothing to offer. But I highly doubt what you say about being a healer is true. Because if it were you would not be defending this ridiculous nerf to sorcs.

I don’t know all the finer details of the sorc. I’m not a theory crafter, I want to try these changes, I want to know the impact on sorc healing and i want to test it for myself. I’m not saying sorc changes are good, I’m saying they might be

Again with the naiveté. You must not pay attention to past changes to sorc heals. You can’t honestly look at the cost of all those heals and say “that can be a good thing.” Your tiny pvp brain cannot comprehend how terrible those patch notes really are. Nothing needs to be changed with the sorc heals. The heals do not need to be increased and the sure as hell do not need to cost more.

Again with the ad hominems. With the force regeneration as it is, increase in force costs really aren’t unexpected, not very bad. However, changing consumption te regenerate force a lot worse at the same time may very well be extremely painful for sorcs, we’ll just have to wait and see.

I guess so because it will prove my point yet again. All spec nerfs are based on PVP and nothing else

Well if you think that raising the cost of all heals is a good thing then I guess you will get what you want. Although I can see any benifit of running out of power all the time.

Well, a class that can use every heal it wants without ever worrying about it’s cost can take an increase in force consumption. And getting some more healing power from each heal is hardly what i call a bad thing.

Those “heal increases” have NEVER been what they make them out to be. Its a bait n’ switch scam. Haven’t you ever noticed that they never tell you how much they are going to increase it? Its because they do not want players to know that they are about to get screwed hard. It happens everytime they do a nerf. The “pros” never out weigh the “cons.” Never has never will. Sorc heals are going to be terrible. And for anybody that thinks its hard to get a healer in a group now…..just wait. You wait times will go so high that you will not want to raid anymore. Tanks and healers are crazy hard to come buy for raids. Why in the hell would you nerf a class that is already hard to come by? This patch makes absolutely no sense. Its no different from saying to a tank. “Hey we will be lowering your def rating by 15% but its ok because we will be giving you an unknown increase in HP. Its a freaking joke and absolutely nothing good will come of this patch.

We’ll see, I do agree them not mentioning any percentages seems suspicious, but assuming it’s going to be bad just because well I can’t get behind that. I’d like to see for myself how my sorc healer will do.

Well good luck with that.I can tell you from personal experience that is will not and now I will have to use a healer that I do not enjoying playing all because people ca’t stop whining. I can’t wait for this game to finally end.

Of course you aren’t. You don’t know anything about healing period. Al you know is that you do not like how sorc healers play in PVP so you want it nerfed. Quit trying to dance around it.

Assumptions, assumptions and baseless accusations, I have nothing more to say here.

Of course you don’t because I have proved you wrong on every single comment you have made since you opened you damn mouth.

No, it’s because you keep throwing baseless accusations and ad hominems around and that post really has no merit whatsoever.

They are not baseless assumptions. Every single person that has posted anything about this nerf has agreed with my views. So what are the chances that you are the only one that is correct that this is not a PVP based patch. Your ignorance is truly unbelievable.

The baseless assumptions are you constantly assuming I only pvp, only as a dps and for some reason i want sorc healing to be terrible

Not once did I say you only PVP. If you would actually pay attention you would see that I said is that you only care about PVP. And anyone that reads your post can see that. Again you are dancing around who and what you really are.

No you are inferring things from my posts. And you’re doing so to fit your own narrative that i am somehow the scum of the game. I do not only care about pvp and you have at least once made the argument that i want sorcs to be terrible because i can’t kill them.

Not a single person will read any of your posts and come to the conclusion that you are an objective player. You clearly favor PVP and are more concerned with nerfing classes that you do not play in order to make your classes more valuable. Not ONE person has come forward to defend your claims. You are a joke and by me and others disproving you all morning you have only dug yourself into a deeper hole is showing your true colors. You are not objective. You know nothing about the sorc healing class and no one will take you seriously after the comments you made today

Hardly, you just infer wrongly, I have mainly talked pvp here, indeed. That doesn’t mean I think it’s more important than pve. I voice pvp concerns here, because i think those opinions too should be voiced and considered.
You on the other are clearly not objective, you seem to have some kind of hate for everything that is pvp. And it is clear that you do not care one bit about pvp.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA I love when you prove my point for me. Look fellow SWTOR players. He proves my point that PVP players are what inspire all these terrible patches regarding classes. PVP voices are they only ones that matter to Bioware and PVP players. Clearly if you are in a tiny minority but complain more than anyone, you get your way. People like this guy disgust me. I have never believed in a community ruled by a complaining minority because a majority like the way things are. Truly and utterly pathetic you are Adje Yo

I never said that there isn’t aloud minority of the pvp players that gets too much attention. There is, and it’s annoying, I’m just saying dismissing changes because you think the only reason they happen is pvp related is no excuse. You’re judging the entirety of the pvp players based on the actions of a few.

The entire PVP community is a few. My God do you listen to yourself? And I want you to name one instance (other than expansions and level cap increases) where there was a class or spec changed in this game that was not based on PVP players complaining about that spec. I want the link the date and the patch. I guarantee you that there isn’t a single one that took place where a PVP post wasn’t made that inspired the patch and was solely based on benefiting the PVE community. NOT A SINGLE ONE

Can you prove that – all – those patches are because PvP’ers complained? Can you link a developer interview for all those patches where they say it’s because of PvP? Of course you can’t. Just as he can’t prove the opposite. You try to sell wild guesses as facts and proof.

My proof is that there is no PVE player that would willing ask for a nerf. And since PVE players play together rather than against each other they would not ask for a fellow teammate to be nerfed. Every change has happened because of the minority of PVP players. That is the facts

That is not a fact, it’s an assertion. PvE players ask for class changes just as well. Blaming every patch ever on pvp is unreasonable and please as you can somehow magically see the motivation behind every single change the game ever went through, I’d like to see you name a few

I don’t have to. I am not the one defending PVP players. You are. Oh and the “change” that PVE players ask for are all buffs. Not nerfs. You have no base for your claims. You can keep telling yourself that it’s not PVP players but it always has been and always will be because PVP players can’t stop screwing with other peoples’ classes because they don’t like losing in WZs.

I want you to explain to me why any PVE player would ask for a nerf. Go ahead and please enlighten me.

Generally, at a certain time there are a few dps classes doing better than the other. Raid teams prefer to have these classes, because it’s vastly superior. This is very annoying and leads to people pretty much having to reroll, and people generally don’t like rerolling.

LMAO that is the poorest excuse I have ever heard. As you are so fond of saying its part of the game deal with it. I am part of a raid team that does not have the highest dps classes, and also does not have the highest dps class. Not to mention we have used the same classes and specs since day one. And it gets really irritating having to relearn our rotations just because the PVP players light up the forums on something they don’t like. And you also accuse me of stereotyping PVP players when you are doing that exact thing by saying raid teams don’t accept certain classes. The only difference is that PVP players get what they want and PVE players are left relearning everything all over again. PVP players need to get over losing in a WZ and either leave the game or learn how to play the game with a better strategy rather than screwing everyone else over.

So there goes your reason for why a PVE player would ask for a nerf. Lets try again. Give me a reason why a PVE player would ask for a nerf on a fellow teammate.

Even if not every single raid team does, the general trend is still there, and how many raid teams feature a madness sorc, hmm?

In addition, BioWare itself also has an idea of class balance, if a class performs too good PvE wise, BioWare will notice, wether people report it or not. Look at operative healer, BioWare said it was trivialising hard content and decided to make it the least mobile healer class there is in 3.0. They are changing that slowly, but the effect is still felt.

See I know for a fact that the patch you are referring to was based on complaints made by PVP players. They complained that is was too hard to kill a player in a WZ that was being healed by a mobile Operative. I watch the forums. I know what the PVP players say and whine about all the time. You are still incorrect in your statements. OH and FYI my raid team does have a madness sorc. Yes his dps isn’t as high as others but we work as a team to adjust to the raids because we care about our members and how they like to play.

Good for your raid team, really. But again, anactdotal evidence is eager at best. Too bad Bioware released this statement:”Overall, Medicine healing was too good during Rise of the Hutt Cartel, so players of the discipline should brace themselves for a rebalancing that might seem a bit extreme. While it might seem extreme, this rebalancing is only aimed to bring Operative healing down to a level that allows other healers to be more competitive and prevents Operative healing from trivializing PvE content that is meant to be challenging.”


PvP and PvE affect each other, so is the nature of a game with both PvE and PvP elements. You’re just gonna have to learn to live with it.

You really are a fool if you believe that. PVP should NEVER role into the PVE world. They can make those changes to a player when they enter into a warzone or PVP area and leave the PVE alone. They are just too damn lazy to do it. Perfect example when the game first launched PVP players complained that the stun for a sorc could reach too far so the lowered the range from 30 meters to 10 meters. There is absolutely no reason to lower the distance of that stun in PVE. All this crap they do to appease the PVP player is frustrating and unnecessary. They could fix the issues in PVP and leave it alone everywhere else. Better yet design a skill tree that is speciffically designed for a natural PVP boost and deal with those when they need to make changes. Other games do it al the time that way PVE players do not get screwed over all the freaking time.

That’s just not how it works, not to mention how annoying it’ll be to code that all, it will be confusing. When you want to do some casual pvp you’ll have to completely relearn your class if every skill suddenly has a different effect. And how relevant are stuns anyways in the world of PvE, there’s only one boss in the currently hardest ops where i can see it being of some use; Revanite Commanders, and even there it isn’t that big a deal.

Well if the stun isn’t a big deal then why is the pool such a big deal? All of your points still have no merit. You are trying to go off of a double standard, and you still will not admit that this is all based on PVP. I truly feel bad for you on your views. Its staring you right in the face and you still refuse to open your eyes and see what is right there. And people respec for fights all the time. People have to change gear all the time. It would not be that hard to go from a PVE spec to a PVP spec. AND they rewrote all the coding for the new trees anyway. It would not be that hard to make an additional tree. Come on man get it together and quit trying to hide behind Bioware’s skirts.

But yes, PvE players are less likely to ask for nerfs. They do however, like asking for boosts, which are just as harmful as nerfs. Let’s say a class is in a reasonable position, however some PvE players think it’s not good enough and whine for boosts. This class now becomes good, too good sometimes. This will lead to BioWare nerfing the class again, and it’ll be nerfed into the ground.

See this is where you are wrong again. Bioware does nothing to nerf classes UNLESS asked to by players. Again I say why would they complain about a team member being too powerful when it benifits them.

You are the one constantly making the argument that PvPers are ruining this game and are the source of all nerfs. You are the one asserting things, you have the burden of proof.

Oh and if you can’t prove it then you need to shut your trap. All of your comments are based that this game does not bend to the whim of PVP players at every turn. When it does on EVRY SINGLE PATCH.

That’s quite a bold claim, can you prove to me that the motivation for every single patch and class redisign was pvp inspired?

Where did you get this notion that healers are hard to kill in pvp? If you have 3 dps and a healer per team, healers die very, very fast already. Now if you have a tank, it takes a while longer, but no expierenced pvp player bangs on a guarded healer, that’s just foolishness


The funniest part is how we hear how sorc/sage doesn’t have to worry about regen, where its actually just that they manage it differently, so the benefit of a sorc/sage then, would be that they have admittedly less concern for resources, recovery from tapping out is certainly easier…but they have less burst than the other 2 classes? Sounds…balanced? Sounds unique. Sounds like what makes this class different than the others. Neat.

Why would we want this changed? Sometimes you need burst? Oh…well you have all those resources, time to blow cooldowns and spam the big kid heals. Since recovery isn’t an issue right?

AdjeYo, that’s what CD’s are for. Big alacrity boost, and some free big crits, should get you through the best of times and the burst of times.

“Be glad they decide to give some extra healing power in return,”

“I am altering the deal, pray I do not alter it any further” – Darth Vader

so much focus on this “rebalancing” classes but no visible new content, neither for pvp or pve (yes some ppl do both) or any effort for gameplay improvments. thats why after 4 years of sub, i think i’ll finally cancel my sub soon. its shame. i really liked this game…

Here’s to hoping they’ll add a new operation in 3.3. Hell even a completely new flashpoint would be nice.

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So anyone care to explain me why devs try to force everyone to do PvP pls?
Maybe I miss understood they intention but reading this post imo shows pretty one directon. So pls somebody enlightenment me.

The class changes seem hardly PvP only inspired to me, as for the rest, well I guess they want to make it easier for players to casually pvp a bit which in general is not a bad thing

Well I haven’t mean class changes in general. More this statement:

“Only 2% of the games population has a full set of Dark Reaver” from this post:

But to be honest who cares? Ppes who wanted have full Ranked Gear will farm comms for it anyway so again who really cares about it?
They definitely wanna force all players to do PvP and I think this is a really bad direction.

It seems more like they want to make it easier to get a full pvp set, so even more casual players have a change in pvp

Sure ppl have chance as team’s setup “members” change from time to time. When badly pimped “equipped” player joins to team that’s well pimped and enemy team not so well then they have good chance to win and get dem double points. If really Eaware’s intention is to speed up ppl’s pvp char progression like this then it’s just crap way of doing things. Also known as character progression simplifying.

that’s a miss quote (from you or dulfy, dunno)
he said something like “Only 2% of the _PVP POPULATION_ has a full set of Dark Reaver gear”
they only counted pvpers, they would like more pvpers to get ranked gear
and they also want to make it easier for any pve’er (who Wants to do pvp), to actually gear up fast enough to not be completely useless..

there is no forcing here, there’s only a removing of barriers

edit: have you ever tried farming for min-maxed ranked gear? because it’s a really big pain in the behind to get it, especially if you’re not doing ranked wzs..
a full set of normal gear takes a bit of time, but not too horrible, but ranked gear? insane.. not even thinking about min-maxing yet, that costs maybe double or more of what a normal ranked set costs

Still beating that ridiculous drum. Get the point you moron. No one agrees with you and this patch is PVP INSPIRED. Pull you head out of your ass and pay attention.

Yeah simplifying content.. trololz :/ Or actually in this case making the char progression to happen close to blink of an eye spd.. Trololz Eaware.. :/ Y i’ve been a subber since launch and also supporting with occasional cc packs purchases and regret past 1 – 1.5y cause of devs really putting the product heavily to simplified path.

Is the cost decrease simplifying, or is it just making the grind time lower? Because playing warzones with no expertise to try and get yourself a pvp set is a bit of a pain

Clearly you dont pvp enough…….

Sage-noble sacrifice-spam = medal gain (pvp whiners dont like that).

Scoundrel – healers in pvp felt they needed to move while channeling diagnostic scan

The fact that people ask for these changes confirms we have some awful healers out there.

I don’t think that the noble sacrifice spam is the cause for these changes, otherwise it would have come up way earlier, it’s been like for a long time. As for diagnostic scan on the move, that is completely pvp inspired, but hardly has any impact in pve and gives back some mobility we lost due to 3.0 nerfhammer

I’m obligated to say good healers ALWAYS adopt to changes. Bad healers? Well I’m sure they’ll level a dps now.

What I dont understand is, they want to give us the ability to move wz comms at 99 each… Yet they took away the ability to move 1k at a time via the title buy. What kind of sense does that make? 99 at a time is too small an amount, when you can get 140 a match.

At least they gave the ability back… they could have just raised the comm cap and let your alts rot

This game has come such a long way since I first played it on launch. I’m a returning player and I have to say this game is so much more polished and way better than when I first started playing it. Long Live SWTOR!

Seriously, I’m really having fun playing this game. It’s a nice break from EverQuest, WoW and Call of Duty. I find it really entertaining with great story lines and options. It’s a nice paced, challenging game that is not too overwhelming like other MMO’s. I really do enjoy it.

People usually like and prefer to see the negativity in everything than the good and bright side.

The game really has come a long way…I just hope they don’t mess up the sorc healer with these changes as it’s my favourite class and always has been.

surprising isn’t it? haven’t seen people not shouting they want to cancel their subs (for the tenth time :P) in a while, a nice change ^^

now if prefered players could do ranked pvp then ranked can actually be populated enough for the elo system to work for all and offcourse to make sure the baddies wont be grouped with the good players and vice versa

Honestly Bioware has zero clue on how healing works in PVE. These changes werent needed at all. I main an Operative and Merc healer for HM runs and i heal with both JUST fine. The only reason i dont OP heal on Revan is because H/O is too good lol. People who do not know their class or who struggle with rotations and execution should work on honing their skills before crying for a nerf. Bioware clearly listens to you all though and its really sad.. I am truly just blown away at Bioware for these nerfs.. you spend all this time on this useless crap? I am tired of farming Hard Mode for my 4th alt and i want new content already! Zorz left and many other top rated guilds are joining them. I think a majority of our guild is gonna end up doing the same. Bioware has lost its direction and clearly doesnt know what it needs to do to improve this game. I wish that pvp and pve were separate abilities like they are in FFXIV. The lack of planning is really starting to show and more and more of us are realizing this is just a cash cow and they are going to milk it til its dead and move on.

All these healing nerfs are happening because of a few clueless pvp whiners once again.

I suggested to the devs so many times before that they should stop listening to the pvp whiners because they will only mess the game so much if they keep on listening to the clueless whiners and complainers.

And as whiners they will only whine more, that is how it goes, a whiner never stops whining no matter how many nerfs they do.

I agree with you and I rarely complain on things. I understand nothing will ever be perfect but it just seems that they truly have lost sight of what this game is supposed to be. PvE and PvP are both very important to a successful game.. so why not make it so they dont affect one another? They are clearly lazy and this type of treatment to the classes explains why. None of the healer classes needed a nerf for PVE content. All of them in fact are fairly on par with each other. Our Sorc Healer who heals along side me easily keeps up with me in Revan and Coratanni HM. You know why he does? Because he knows how to play his class. Sometimes I outperform him in certain fights and vice versa. That is supposed to be that way. If you fail to understand your class it doesnt matter what they do to it you will always suck at it. Bioware clearly forgot that when they started catering to the crying masses. Unfortunately for them PvE is only going to continue to shrivel up until there is nothing left. I actually cancelled my account and I am going to try FFXIV. They released a new class, several hours of story and more 2-3 Months BEFORE their expansion. The expansion contains 3 more classes, 50-60 level cap on crafting and jobs plus 8 new dungeons and two raids. They obviously show they care about their subscribers and keep the content flowing freely. I want to be apart of something where the developers actually care. This game is not it.

Just do your Milky-Boy Business with your Challenging NPC’s and leave the fun,entertaining side to Skilled Folks.Oh,if you didn’t notice (yet) you’re whining,just wanted to remind me,xp.

Have a nice Day,Friend.

Here is a guide to post 3.0 class changes: They are for PvP purposes and nothing more.

There doesn’t feel good to know the truth. Not that the truth doesn’t blow donkeys, but at least we know now.

Your Welcome ‘Merica

in the gree event, bounty event, Rakgoul event, OPS or FP or anywhere you can group a mission do i hear a PVE player say damn the OP he is out healing me or that merc is out DPSs me. Nor do I hear someone say i wish the would nerf a maurader a bit b/c he is killing a add in a op to quickly. ALL nerfs are PVP driven. PLEASE make PVE and PVP separate from each other. Then the PVP whiners can nerf each other to death.

It’s unlikely to happen, and making classes different for PvE and PvP is would be damn annoying for anyone playing both.
I’d much rather have them consider both PvE and PvP when changing something. The operative healer changes look pretty good to me though. The sorc healer changes are meh, to me they don’t seem so terrible as some people are saying. I have no merc, so can’t say too much about it.
As for marauder, they are trying to rehash them, but failing terribly, but you can’t blame PvP for that, the watchman changes were just nonsensical.

PvP in this game was poorly conceived and implemented from the beginning. And since day 1 it has fucked up PvE by driving needs. Too late to fix it now, better off to change games.

“The healing dealt by Kolto Injection has been significantly increased.”

… significantly enough to make me want to play again? Because that would be exciting. PvP becoming playable, raids are playable (since 3.2), and now kolto injection no longer a garbage burst heal? I think I need to see if I can afford to sub again, because that’s exciting. 😀

I’m overall quite happy with the operative changes. None are huge changes, the little extra kick from kolto injection is definitely not bad. Recuperative nanotech only costs 15 energy now, which makes a lot easier on the energy to use.

I completely agree with you, i don’t mind if slow-release medpack has its healing reduced, but that boost on the healing done by kolto injection is quite nice. I’m not sure about the changes to sorcs and sages, but operatives and scoundrels definitely got the changes they needed

All content and features on the Public Test Server are not final and are subject to change.

Content? What content …..

That’s a disclaimer Dulfy always puts in the patch update notes, but if you’re asking for content… Yavin Stronghold and Togruta species.

A new face and 3 empty rooms….gee now I can redo my laundry in the outfit designer while my head is looking like the ship from Andromeda (old tv show) in a bunch of empty rooms with generic looks. Yes, I jut summed up the ‘content’ when we exclude the 1 hour Ziost storyline. Might as well turn the servers off for the summer. Halph my guild already has no reason to login. I can imagine we are not the only ones. We all know the next major patch will consist of a flashpoint and probably a massively requested mount flourish ‘content’ ( lol ) for all mounts. /sarcasm
And swtor is from the top 10 MMO’s out there… Even indie developers release more actual content with replayability value.

just tested the sage healer changes on the pts (healing me and my comp in a dummy fight, so it’s not perfect..)
first thing I noticed is that vindicate is a garbage heal atm (heals for 18-28 hp, I’d be surprised if that’s the final number)
it took me only 50secs to get to 0 force, while going full burst, during the burst I got up to 5500 in the first 50 seconds, so that’s pretty nice number
but, then after the first minute, I had trouble to get over 150force, unless using vindicate even more often (I used it 30x in a 5minute fight, so around once every 10 seconds)
after the first minute I was pretty force starved, and my rotation pretty much consisted only of Rejuvenate->healing trance->vindicate->cheap filler->repeat
so now and then I was able to get a wandering mend in, but salvation is just too expensive or slow, using either of those put me back to 0 force again :/

all in all I got 4300 hps in a 5min fight, which isn’t too bad I guess.. but I don’t think BW succeeded in giving sages a usefull burst; you can push amazing numbers for nearly a full minute, but after that, unless you can stop healing for a while, you won’t be able to burst heal anything anymore..
it’s no fun healing on low force

for comparison: on live I don’t really run out of force, and my burst heal is 5250 hps (during the first 50secs again), total healing is 5400 hps (also over 5 minutes)
so.. guess BW has some work to do 😛

Damn… that does not sound promising at all. I love to heal with sorc but from what you report it will start being very frustrating… and basically if what you say is correct, you have one burst chance during an entire fight… people better be perfect at not taking damage then… Anyone else that has gone on pts can add something to this?

it looks worse than it is..
there doesn’t have to be one burst only, it’s just about 50 seconds of it (you can split it up too)
and I didn’t take a brake from healing, in pve there aren’t many fights where you constantly have to heal, in low healing parts of a fight you can go get as much force as you can, while healing needed is low
but on the more intense or undergeared fights it’ll be hard, and somewhat boring too
and btw, the healing numbers of vindicate are very probably bugged, just like last pts patch (even worse now though actually), so if that becomes a half decent heal, the sustained healing done will go up by a bit

I played with it a bit, I don’t really like it though. It just feels bland. The interesting synergy of your personal bubble ticking health, and your running hot offsetting a few quick health nukes, or using a few shots of noble sacrifice when your big self heal is nearly off cooldown just felt right. This new heal is just…well, you covered that, its put to shame by kolto shot and diagnostic scan, and even if you are using it with full stacks for instant cast, it just feels like a waste of a cooldown, and doesn’t feel like it offsets these new inflated skill costs. Bigger numbers? Sure…but who cares when you are bored? Should just rename the class to Generic Healer now.

I really hope they just drop this silliness and head back to the drawing board, or simply leave well enough alone.

Exactly, I like it the way it is, so there’s no improvement like they say it is :/
I found it annoying how it takes all you stacks, I usually used one or two to sacrifice, and the rest on salvation..
But now it’s impossible to instacast salvation, without completely messing up your force
Also I was really surprised that my sustained heals on live was hardly lower than the burst.. (5500 hps vs 5400 hps)

Mark my words, this nerf will mark the beginning of the end of swtor. I saw this same EXACT thing happen to FURY. Peeps complained about healers and they nerfed them into the ground. Healers quit, no more heals, everyone dies too fast. Everyone leaves the game. All you whiny brats are ruining the very game you like. Enjoy it while you can. I am turning my level 60 Mercenary into a Bodyguard, and Ill bet every other healer will roll a bodyguard. Then of course, next patch, that will too get nerfed since you whiny punks will complain and bioware will bring out the nerf bat yet again and finally put the nail in the coffin of this game. Mark those words.

Bullshite, these changes are pretty good for operative healers. As for sorcs, the changes have been revised and now they’re looking pretty darn good. Consuming darkness will restore more force than consumption, no health loss, extra force regained bonus on set bonus and increased force regeneration when used with force surge. The impairment to force regen when used without force surge is less too.

Not sure if you guys have noticed or if you’re just subconsciously zoning it out, but PVP is what is keeping this game alive. Sure there are a few PVErs out there but BW knows which hand feeds them and make all adjustments accordingly.

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