GW2 Arenanet on Buying and Selling Raid Runs

Arenanet has clarified their stance on buying/selling raid runs and possible fraud/RMT.
Over the last few months, we have seen a surge in the number of in-game sales related to the completion of challenging encounters and achievements. We’ve been gathering feedback both internally and externally and we wanted to provide some clarification to players about our policies on this subject.

Reaching back to the roots of Guild Wars, selling “runs” has been a core role for certain members of our community. We recognize that some players are not able to complete all content. Other players have provided a service of convenience or carry through the years, and our official stance is that the selling or buying of runs is completely acceptable.

However, there is a point where things get a little more tricky, such as when account sharing is involved, or when the transfer of enormous wealth for raid runs takes place. At this point, we believe we need to clarify a few things:

  • First, account sharing is incredibly risky, as it often leads to the compromise of the account, after which the account may be locked for an indefinite period of time, or permanently terminated. We very seldom are able to retrieve and return a previously shared account to its owner, which is why we strongly recommend that you never share your account with anyone.
  • Second, after digging into the origins of the funds involved in large transfers, we learned that almost all of them were directly involved in some form of Fraud and/or RMT. Obviously, Fraud is disallowed, and Real Money Trading (RMT) is absolutely against the rules.

Purchasing a high-cost run directly, or purchasing gold or items to exchange for a run, is likely to result in account action against the purchaser and in some cases the runner(s), as well. While the runner(s) may be unaware that the funds originated from Fraud/RMT, in fact they can be found to be in possession of stolen goods and their account may be impacted by that involvement.

In summary, the buying and selling of runs is acceptable, but ArenaNet does not officially support buyers or sellers. Buying or selling of runs is done at your own risk. If we investigate a transfer and establish that funds originated from fraud or RMT, we will take action against all parties involved. That action, depending on the situation, could include removal of funds, account suspension, and/or account termination.

Source: https://en-forum.guildwars2.com/discussion/28073/buying-and-selling-runs

  • Madeleine Leroy

    Haha, what a mess. I pity that development team. A great game is being thrown deeper and deeper into the shit hole because of decisions like this… Never did I read a crock of shit like this…

    • Refresh Azure

      What? saying if you interact with some one who interacted with RMT and they trade you that gold that you may get a ban has been a MMO standard for decades.

      Both wow and ffxiv do this stuff all the time.

      There is no way to tell if the person knows if the gold is illegal or not all gold trade has risk even in wow or ffxiv.

    • Jalen Dmello

      Huh?? if you buy stolen property without knowing its stolen, that property will be sent back to the owner and you won’t be compensated
      That’s basically what the devs are stating .

  • FrycoN

    Yes we all know Anet dont give a shit untill someone reduce their money making

    • Apple Salad

      Free will.

  • Jalen Dmello

    When ppl are trying to sell runs and then say come on voip, its shady and its to be investigated
    If there is something so important to say they can’t it in a text chat, it is more or less fraudulent lmao

    • Don36669

      Or people just prefer to have everyone in a voicechat because that makes it easier to organize and run the raid, especially during fights. Typing while fighting high pressure fights can be a big liability, after all. It’s how my group does it and we don’t sell runs at all.

      • Jalen Dmello

        I am not talking about organized raids, i am talking of *selling raids, that’s the 7 th word in my line, why did yeah get so defensive??
        Why is typing a number on whisper text chat so difficult that it requires voip?? Maybe because it isn’t about gold at all

  • I know what RMT is, but what kind of “fraud” are they talking about? Also, (I’m not a runner, but) how would the the runner know where the gold came from and why would they get in trouble?

    • Hawks

      RTM is real money transaction, as in cash. They’re talking about real fraud not gold or gems.

  • duhhagain

    No one would bother buying raid runs IF YOU ANET ASSHOLES DIDN’T GATE LEGENDARY ARMOR BEHIND RAIDS

    • B

      Play PvP or WvW , dumbass

      • B

        That was so mean, but you got a point. True story ppl forgetting about other ways for the legendary armor and blame anet , that they cant play

      • meonthissite

        Well First of all, not everyone likes playing PVP or WVW for obvious reasons such as class imbalance that still exists to this day since beta, yet another issue they’ve ignored. Just play an engineer you’ll see what I mean.

        Second, the idea of the game and what was said at launch was play as you’d like to play, and still have the same access to progression in the game that everyone else has. That means, PVE should not be locked behind impossible standards because PVP and WVW are not. TADAAAA

        • B

          First im playing engineer in all gamemodes. Second i started Raiding last year with 0 LI in a training guild, And TADAAA build my second legendary armor last week, and even done all CM bosses. Doesent seem inpossible if you want it, go for it and stop crying. There are always training guilds.

    • Tora

      Learn the raid mechanic by watching videos, then fake you KP/LI with any chat generator online to get in. I did this and got my coalescense precursor in a couple of days. Then give the silent middle finger to those asking over 1500g for a boss kill. As long as you learned the raid mechanic before coming, get into a meta build and do well no one will ever know or care you faked your way in

    • Tri

      get gear, learn a build, join a learning run or a guild looking to raid. its not hard people just give up.

      I tried to help people get into raiding and after they couldn’t kill the boss on the first few attempts a lot of them gave up because it can actually be challenging.

    • King Taku

      Play WvW or PvP and upgrade your gear. Sure, that takes an enormous amount of time but if you are too lazy to learn raiding then that’s what you have to do for it. Legendaries are supposed to be an achievement, play the game to get them.

    • duhhhhhhhhhhhh

      oh fuck off you dimwits, everyone who plays this game has had full pinks +18x for ages now. We’re talking about SKINS here, not stats. i.e. the only reason to play these garbage raids.

    • Trillium

      how is that different from any other skins being gated behind PvP/WvW/lots of grind/etc?

  • Tora

    Thats all too good and all Anet. however if you are actually ok with this then you should atleast give raid sellers they own lfg tab for “raid services” or something so they dont spam the main raid lfg tab. Rly i opened to try to get into a group yesterday and there were 7 raid sellers filling the chat

  • meonthissite

    Once again a major design flaw that was pointed out during the earliest beta comes back to bight Arenanet in the butt. Just more proof that these developers who originally made the game were in fact not gamers and did not understand how mmorpgs work.

    • Alot

      Could you explain the flaw in game design? Unless you decrying the existence of raids I’m not seeing it.

      • Steve

        If a person says something that makes no sense, their explanation will probably be just as bad. Best to ignore and just enjoy the game.

        • Alot

          Its poor form to accuse people of speaking nonsense without asking them to explain their views -.-

      • Ares Zax

        I do think that ANet really should reconsider creating an “easy mode” for players who just want to see the story in raids without having to pony up large sums of money or put in a huge investment in time/gold to gear themselves up for raids. I have a number of friends who came over from GW1 and they were quite disgruntled to find that the conclusion of the Saul D’Alessio story was basically locked behind raids. (And yet again now with the Dhuum fight in Hall of Chains.)

        What’s more, parts of LS3 make little to no sense if you never played raids. There’s the part where your character greets Squad Leader Benett in Bloodstone Fen as if you know him, but if you’ve never done W1-3, you have no idea who the hell he is. And later, your character also talks about the Eye of Janthir as if you’ve seen it before, but again, if you’ve never done raids (or if you never played GW1), then again the player has no idea what the hell the Eye is or what role it plays in the White Mantle. It’s extremely poor storytelling on ANet’s part, and not something one should see in a AAA game.

        And because I can hear the argument about preserving exclusivity coming from some raiders, If it’s that important, then just make it so Easy Mode doesn’t drop any of the unique skins or Magnetite Shards. Done.

        And also, because I’ve heard someone in-game say it before, no, telling people to “just watch the raid on Youtube” is not a solution. That’s like telling someone not to go see a movie and just read the plot summary on Wikipedia.

        • King Taku

          Getting raid gear is NOT a huge investment.
          You can get into raids with exotics, easily.

          • Copper Wiley

            You say that, but would you personally have someone in your group who’s only in exotics? If so, hey wanna run some raids with a holo engi in subpar gear?

            • King Taku

              The stat difference is minimal between exotics and ascended, but you do have a point about certain stat combinations. But even then, a few, 1 or 2, maybe 3, ascended trinkets aren’t asking for too much imo.

              • Apple Salad

                Problem is, most if not all just don’t do Raid, could be out of fear or not interested in learning the mechanics. People need things to blame to make them feel not in the wrong and it works. And I do dare say this, most of the players that commented on raid, never actually did one.

          • Jalen Dmello

            You are not getting into raids with exotics ,try tagging all lfg groups and see who will take you
            Link gear — oh exotic—kick

            • King Taku

              Wait for a training group that won’t do that, get better at the fights themselves. Gear barely matters, as long as you know the mechanics in the end, because those cause wipes and not that you deal 4k less dps because your stats aren’t min maxed. Yes, there certainly are MANY groups who would do that and I agree with you, but that shouldn’t keep people out. There are just as many people who either don’t really care or who are friendly about it. I found a nice community like that as well after thinking this elitism is way too “scary” to ever dive into

        • Alot

          I disagree on the story aspect. While parts of living world season 3 may have been badly done, I see no problem with reserving a self contained piece of lore as a reward for completing an insane challenge. You don’t have to know who Dhuum is or how he was put down to continue with the story of the elder dragons. Saving those moments for people who manage to complete that insane raid is fine by me.

          • Jalen Dmello

            You can’t have a story jump from A to C and skip B and claim we are saving B for a moment, the moment is ruined when you reached C
            Its ludicrous

            • Alot

              I cant actually recall the issue you all bringing up. In the raids you kill one of the white mantle’s leaders and let out lazarus – so to speak. Later on you talk to a pact soldier as is you know him (which isn’t too unbelievable for the commander of the pact) and there are several references to the white mantle leader being dead. Enemy commanders are occasionally allowed to die off screen. They not all contractually obligated to die by your hand.

      • meonthissite

        It’s not raids at all in fact I am not talking about the issues with raiding I’m talking about them leaving a perfectly great design in HoT when they released the latest expansion. It has no progression at all, not even for the purpose of earning cosmetics. There are no vendors with new weapons or skins or armors. It’s completely pointless outside of the main story of the expansion and once you complete that really it’s just an achievement grind.

  • The One Copper Bard

    This should be a no brainer type of thing. I wasn’t really introduced to raids until I played WoW ages ago (2008) and found out about the spots they would sell to people who want to see that content in either getting whatever gear or seeing the rest of the story play out. Its no different here on GW2 if someone wants to see that content just once or see on whatever they can get out of one run. I hate raids myself but I see no harm nor no foul for someone wanting to buy a spot into a raid. It is a very risky and optional thing to do so if you can do it, do it. The Dev Team is not responsible for your own stupidity if you get taken for a ride in a 50/50 chance rigged spot.

  • Dario Jarpa

    Anet, as useless as EA or Capcom.

    • King Taku

      How so?

    • Madeleine Leroy

      I am afraid you have a point there. The passion and vision this game had is gone. To bad…

      • answerer

        Which one?
        where they create a large, vibrant and living world where many people with different interests can unite, and work together, or go their own way in different playstyles?
        to the extend we have various forms of PvE and PvP content
        The passion and vision is still very much there. Of course some things had to make way for “reality” because just not everything is possible in reality.
        But as far as I’m concerned, anet is still very true to it’s original ideologies.

        • Stephan Marberry

          Lol, no. Most of us have moved on to better games, thanks.

          • Atlas

            lol rofl krass… most of “US”? Don’t speak for others!

            • Stephan Marberry

              I don’t need to. The numbers speak for themselves.

              • Ricky Grimes

                The numbers…of what? You have no numbers…

                The only known numbers are the $$$ numbers and they were pretty good at the end of last year…

              • Annoyed

                Pretty good for Gw2 but unfortunately its still below Lineage lowest sells that year. Fortunately, there are couple games sells below gw2 under the same company.

              • Annoyed

                What numbers? Source? Sauce?

          • KinoREN.

            “Most of us” you have leaved the game and think everyone else have done it, the game is very well populated, just stop crying and go play your “better games”.

            • Madeleine Leroy

              You just want to deny it because you can’t handle the facts. A lot of people left this game and that is a proven fact.

              • answerer

                sure, from any point of view 5 people could be a “lot of people”
                but whatever you consider a lot of people, many more times that are still playing.
                People who dislike the game will only see it’s fault, and try to press it on others.
                Especially toxic when you try to force them as “facts” when they’re really nothing more than the opinions of one person who stopped playing.
                I’m saying you’re the only one, but you’re hardly talking for the populace here.

              • KinoREN.

                The facts? Bring then, if is a fact bring it, you must have a lot of graphics from confiable sources to back up that “proven fact” affirmation.

              • Apple Salad

                Fact is some people did left for reasons (bored,lost interest, time etc) but there are also new players that joined for the game.

                Fact is, some people left for better games, but still keeping an eye on the game.

              • KinoREN.

                Ohhhhhhh this is incridble, i can’t believe in that, are you saying to me as every MMO in history some players left after the great hype looking for something new? And beyond that we have new players comming and old’s leaving?

                What i’m talking here is about the apocalyptic scenario of mass population loss who those haters are trying to paint.

              • Apple Salad

                Altho I don’t know what “better games” is being referred to. But like it or not there will be players leaving here and there due to reasons especially if the game evolved/new stuff are implemented. Just like how I once enjoyed tetris, mario etc. Only memories and nostalgia. Could be the game evolved not into their preference, no partners or friends to enjoy with, interest or rl issues etc. But it doesn’t mean the game is bad. There will be new and old players joining finding the changes enjoyable and stayed.

              • Annoyed

                Now thats what a call white knight and death knight. If they think this game is dead then good, one less Sith Lord in gw2. If you think this game is still great then good, cause its true for some people. I personally think GW2 is one great game for new player, but its lacking interesting content for vet/long time player like me. I currently playing other mmos but im sure as hell will come back to gw2 once i get bored with this rebound mmo.

                I knew some people that are no longer playing gw2 but keep checking for updates and hoping for the death of gw2 so they think they made the right decision but i just cant help to read all the dramas they made.

        • Gundam

          Acculay there is some much dirt aroung gw2 at this moment you could
          wrote short book about this. I advice to do yours own resarch and see
          for yourself. Moust of this come out after HoT relese and shit started
          hiting fan around ep.4 of lw.3 relese. Moust of this are broken
          promices, lies, or just shitting on pilars that that game was build on(accesable, shifting world, rewarding to play for everyone)

        • catcatchers

          Bravo! lots of shiny knights are defending your claims….

          By the way the things you mentioned, every game-makers has to do in order to extend the life line of the game and to stay in the market. Nothing new if you are vet. to the gaming world or to business world.

          This game have lots of goods and bads.. There is no denial that some of the fundamental principles of this game have changed. for e.g. “Loot-boxes” are now aggressively marketed and many others.

          • Answerer

            I’m sure you’ve realized by now there are only toxic sourpusses blighting anet for anything and everything they do. Or shiny white-knights who would defend anet at the gates of hell. There is no middle ground.

            • catcatchers

              i am sure there is a middle ground which can give this game-makers a good feedback – not the likes of wooden potatoes who basically depends on this game to make living.

              I understand from where you are coming from but having lots of shiny white-knights and dark knights will hurt the game in the long run.

  • Gundam

    Can you hear their hopeless scream ?
    Can you smell their stink of fear ?
    On pride wings once they flew
    I will greet them when they fall

  • Trillium

    I don’t understand why people are hissy about selling runs.
    I remember they had same reaction when Arah selling was still a thing. As if a person should do the long tedious bullcrap that was Arah just to get some tokens.

    • lore

      I think the problem is that some people are using the runs as a way to committ fraud, which is a crime. If A Net knows of that, and takes no action- they are complicit.

      Remember, you can buy gems with real life cash, which ties the whole thing to actual legal currency.

      I don’t think they went far enough. They should ban it just to protect themselves, its really not worth the risk- business wise. They could ban it but not police it, if they want to let buying the runs continue.

      I also think it is very toxic for the game. This game had a pretty good community going. It seems to me that the raids (for whatever reason) have had a large negative effect on the community. The whole thing just doesn’t seem worth it to me.

      It would be interesting to see actual participation numbers on the raids. What percentage of players (without buying a run) are actually completing the raids?

      Is it a high enough percentage to warrant locking: parts of the story, legendary armor behind raids, the development time for the raids and creating a toxic community along with risking the whole fraud complicity.

      I severely doubt it. You have to wonder what they are thinking with this whole thing…

      • Don36669

        Like the article stated, selling runs has been a staple of GW since the first game. That in itself is not the problem. Banning

  • kazerniel

    I wonder if they separated the raid LFG into actual LFG / buying-selling / raid guild recruitment it would considerably decrease the current negative sentiment?

    • Apple Salad

      Won’t solve the issue. I think there are players that got scammed buying raids. E.g. they were asked to make the deposit/full payment first and did not get “carried” after. Or they were asked to pass account info so they could use their account to do it for them.

  • Mr. Principal

    Make different difficulties for Raids like Easy (Story/no challenge/no rewards/ no achv) – Normal (Story+Achievements/unique rewards) – Hard (Dunno what have here! More challenging..?) and no one will moan about raids anymore..

    • Tsar CUBE

      I think the real problem is the fact that it’s 10 man content and not 5 man. 10 man is just too hard to get organised. If they were 5 man, people would be running them just as much as they do fractals.

  • jeremiaha

    Getting raid gear is NOT a huge investment.You can get into raids with exotics, easily.

    • Annoyed

      Finding the other 9 who would take the risk is the hardest part. Beside, whats hard is to keep the group stick up for the next raid. Not everyone can play on the same day and time plus have a long playtime. Not expecting a superhero reflex player but looking for a replacement that could replace the missing experienced player, especially the one who knows what to do and wont bitching when he died, is exactly the issue.

  • U N C L E

    Anet will never take action against raid sellers or will have to punish 90% + of the playerbase. Of 4 guilds that I am member, everybody with 259 master points bought runs. There are a lot of players or guilds earning insane amounts of gold running slots in raid runs. I told my guildies to not take part of it but nobody heard me.

  • Sindariel

    TL:DR
    Nothing’s gonna change. We just wanted to let you, that we don’t care.

  • HadesClutch

    Raids are a double-edged sword. Part of the problem that made Selling Runs so prevalent, was that the raids were made slightly more difficult for casual play and super long. The length of time required means more time invested and since GW2 made it’s hallmark on being a game you can pop in for an hour, play, and drop – only to return weeks later, it kind of back fired. PUGs just don’t do all that well in the Raids and due to them being so long, it becomes tedious.

    • Annoyed

      The GW2 you once knew is no longer exist since HoT or at least since that creepysmile meme guy left.

  • Doomer1

    Never have had a chance to do a raid. Wanted to do one in HOT but could never find a group that would let me come along. All but given up on raids. Nice to read about them I guess.

    • Annoyed

      Raid is fun… if only i could gathered 9 other players who can log in the same day, have the same/more playtime and patience as mine. But no, they decided it would be better to keep making raids and short fractals instead of adding new dungeon as well.

      • Doomer1

        Honestly if I never do a raid in my lifetime I will survive, at a minimum I would like to get the mastery point in heart of thorns if I were to try to accomplish anything.

        • RabbitUp

          You can join a training guild if you are interesting in raids. It’s best that you have a meta build for your class, and practise the rotation on the training golem, but everyone will be a beginner so not much pressure. It’s important that you read a guide for the boss you are going to kill to get familiar with the mechanics (dulfy has good guides), although the commander will still try to explain to everyone.

          SC’s website is excellent for everything raid-related
          More info here: https://snowcrows.com/newtoraids/
          And meta builds: https://snowcrows.com/builds/

          • Doomer1

            Thank you I will look into these sites and see what I have and what I still need to make one of these builds

  • Ainseland

    Yea boss kills are SAB-100g, Matts-200, Xera-300, deimos-500g, Dhumm 1-2k gold crew those prices from sellers on lfg…

    This year we will see who will be the lucky dog that will received those penalties Anet mentioned about if the funds came from black market..

    ya i know there so many way to get gold including RMT slightly similar to buying Gems with our hard earn $/cash and trade it for gold

    in addition those crazy price/high-cost on challenge mote boss kill

  • Lobsang Dawa

    isn’t buying gem from gemstore with real money and than exchange that for gold to pay for raid or other things to another player is RMT?

    also if i play on my friends account to do raid cause he got full time job and cant raid, do i or my friend get banned?

    • Ainseland

      we all do dat, but some players who have enormous wealth came from selling or black market will have a 500g restriction on mail/guild bank withdraw, so they ended up using their 2nd account or friend’s account to withdraw/transfer/mail/etc the enormous wealth and ended up to be subjected as “directly involved in some form of Fraud and/or RMT. Obviously, Fraud is
      disallowed, and Real Money Trading (RMT) is absolutely against the
      rules.”

    • Annoyed

      Apparently buying gold via gemstore is not real monay trading. As long as you give aNet your monays then its okays.

  • Ainseland

    i still cant believe those seller i talked too, their price 4 CM dhuum is 6k gold insanely crazy amount of gold 4 dat

  • alan

    Anet agree Buying and selling Raid, how about Anet sell us the Raid run with cheapest price or by Gem.

  • Colin Corcoran

    Raids aren’t my cup of tea… dungeons, story missions, etc… Right now I’m building a guildhall out. No way I’d drop that kind of money on a raid.

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